ContraPoints (Natalie Wynn)

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liola
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Re: ContraPoints (Natalie Wynn)

Post by liola » Fri Oct 18, 2019 10:27 am

Am I the only one rolling their eyes reading the "I have other reasons but I will explain in my next video" like... why? Why can't you write them in a post, for instance since you're communicating that you're aware of the issue to your patreon audience only? I know she doesn't need this tricks to get people to watch her videos but to me is a bit of a low reach.

It also doesn't exclude the fact that she apparently knowingly featured a transmedicalist non-binary exclusivist in her video, and I cannot understand what possible reason there can be that would justify that. It just leaves a sour taste in my mouth honestly, and it's starting to be a common point with her which just makes me sad because I respect her and her opinions and knowledge a lot. Just not great.
Will probably never be over the BONCAS and the beauty of Phil Lester.



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Re: ContraPoints (Natalie Wynn)

Post by Katka » Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:29 pm

poweroftriangles wrote:She does so much research, it's hard to believe she missed this
At the risk of sounding petty but I'm starting to question how well she researches her topics. As I've said before, she called Oscar Wilde English. You just have to Wikipedia him to find out he was in fact Irish and why it's not cool to call him English at all. This might seem like a small thing in comparison but Oscar Wilde and his trials are a major negative turning point in British lgbtq history so it leaves me salty. And as much as I love Dan, his posh English voice was really not the best choice for Wilde considering all this.

I'm with liola on the explanation. Her inclusion of Buck in the video made a lot of nonbinary trans people - and binary trans people as well - feel bad and she should have just cleared it up properly. "I'm gonna tell you in my next video" sounds to me like she's trying to grab clicks while she's at it and that's turning me off her real quick. Might be she's just better at explaining things on video than written down but she could have just dropped a video then instead of this. She did some really good videos in the past and I'm glad she made those but she's moving in a weird direction recently.

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Re: ContraPoints (Natalie Wynn)

Post by spacedementia » Fri Oct 18, 2019 9:09 pm

i don’t think she’s milking it for clicks necessarily, because I’m willing to bet the majority of her funding comes thru patreon donors, anyway. it’s probably just the theme of the next video, and she wants the full 20-something minutes to explain fully. although a dumb way to go about it, i don’t think she has ill intent. when she befriended theryn, theryn had a complete change of heart and apologised for everything. i’m hoping that’s the case here, though i really don’t see how it could happen. still, nat needs to look into some pr or something.

i’m gonna wait for a real answer on this, but if it’s not decent, it’ll be the nail in the coffin and i’m going to unsub. first there’s the interview where she supports marianne williamson and kim petras, then she’s still supporting jeffree star, and then she’s milking this buck angel controversy right after the whole twitter issue.

(a very petty and ultimately non consequential aside: im kind of an oscar wilde stan, and actually, he adopted an english accent at oxford. also, multiple accounts claimed he spoke in kind of a sing-songy, articulate voice (people dug this all up to prove whether or not an alleged recording was actually his). dan was actually a pretty great choice imo, except for the fact his tone was probably a bit high pitched to be accurate. not that they would care too much about the accuracy of a voiceover that lasts a few seconds. I mean, no one even bothered to double check that he was, in fact, irish. :? )

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Re: ContraPoints (Natalie Wynn)

Post by Katka » Fri Oct 18, 2019 9:52 pm

spacedementia wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 9:09 pm
(a very petty and ultimately non consequential aside: im kind of an oscar wilde stan, and actually, he adopted an english accent at oxford. also, multiple accounts claimed he spoke in kind of a sing-songy, articulate voice (people dug this all up to prove whether or not an alleged recording was actually his). dan was actually a pretty great choice imo, except for the fact his tone was probably a bit high pitched to be accurate. not that they would care too much about the accuracy of a voiceover that lasts a few seconds. I mean, no one even bothered to double check that he was, in fact, irish. :? )
Same, hi. :D I realise he had an English accent but I still don't think Dan was a good choice. I guess you've seen The Happy Prince? I think Rupert Everett did very well in the scenes where Oscar is addressing the crowd at the theatre or just generally "being Oscar". At least his delivery is very close to what I always thought Wilde might have spoken like. Less "posh" or whatever you wanna call it and more dramatic like with a real impact. People loved to listen to him after all. Idk, it's not even that important.

I could also get into how quoting from "Dorian Gray" like every line from that book was actually Wilde's own opinions riles me up loads but let's not and pretend we did.

(This wasn't meant to turn into a critique of Dan's five second long voice acting, he did well enough, I'm sorry.)

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Re: ContraPoints (Natalie Wynn)

Post by obsessivelymoody » Wed Nov 06, 2019 10:45 pm

I think Natalie fucked up with the whole Buck Angel situation, but I don't think she—or anyone for that matter—deserves the sheer amount of plain bullying and hate she's had to go through over the last while. I personally could barely watch her Octobee AMA stream because she just seemed so uncomfortable and anxious, and it was super upsetting.

Idk. She's not perfect. It sucks that she inadvertently hurt so many people, but it's clear that she didn't mean to. I do wish she could release some kind of statement—perhaps through her assistant to make it easier—so it doesn't make the Buck Angel thing seem like some weird stunt for her videos. But even then, the way this situation has escalated into something fuelled in such intense hatred is horrible to see.

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Re: ContraPoints (Natalie Wynn)

Post by Katka » Thu Nov 07, 2019 7:18 pm

Natalie's actions are literally the cause for a lot of bullying and hate directed at nonbinary and trans people on social media these last few weeks as well and no one is sticking up for them like this. Her stans are trying to uncancel Buck Angel despite all of the horrible things he has said and done just because she featured him in a video. Instead of apologising, she defended that choice and Buck in her stream. I'm sorry, but I can't feel too much sympathy for her right now when it's the nonbinary and trans communities suffering because of her thoughtless tweets and actions.

No one deserves to be bullied but she's not being bullied. She's being rightfully criticised for a series of major fuck ups. No one is perfect, I agree, and everyone is allowed to fuck up and learn but she's not learning and she's making the same hurtful mistakes over and over again. And, really, I can't take her serious when she says she loves nonbinary people when she can't even apologise for featuring someone as hateful as Buck Angel in a video.

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Re: ContraPoints (Natalie Wynn)

Post by obsessivelymoody » Thu Nov 07, 2019 10:43 pm

I didn't realise stans were literally trying to do that. I should research better before I post and make an opinion. And as a cis person, I sincerely apologize for inserting myself into this conversation in the first place because I don't have a place in this discussion. I'm upset and sad that people are hurt and being bullied and hated on, and I hope the people bullying can get a grip and educate themselves on the topic, and if they can't do that I hope they can fuck off.

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Re: ContraPoints (Natalie Wynn)

Post by Katka » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:29 pm

i'd like to add that I also hope Natalie is okay. I'm not okay with what she said and did lately but I do not believe she is a bad person or had bad intentions. Sadly that won't undo the damage done but no one in this situation deserves to be bullied or hated, not Natalie, nor the trans and nb-people who are angry with her because they are affected by what she said.

I have to say, as a nb person, seeing Buck featured in her video and then her defending it was rough so I'm not her fan at the moment but I do still believe she means well so hopefully she will take the criticism to heart this time and do better in the future. I think she's one of the most intelligent voices on Youtube at the moment, she's just a bit ignorant about some things but everyone can learn.

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