Dodie

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Re: Dodie

Post by Katka » Wed Jun 21, 2017 10:50 am

human wrote:Her book is actually called "thoughts of the mad" or something like that, a title I find horrendously inappropriate on many levels.
I agree. The title made me think it might be about her struggles with mental illness (I have no idea if she has any mental illnesses, I just thought she might from the title) and I think the title would have been okay for an own voices book about how to deal with this stuff. But it's "just" a Youtube memoir and the title is really inappropriate in that context.

I can't really decide what I think about Dodie anymore. I used to find her pretentious, then I started liking her a bit and now I'm back to finding her pretentious after looking through her instagram. I don't know what she's like in real life but her internet presence isn't my cup of tea at all. She's a great songwriter but her overall image just irks me these days. Her obsession with the colour yellow is a good example I think, I don't like how she acts like she invented it.
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Re: Dodie

Post by onetruetrash » Wed Jun 21, 2017 1:27 pm

Katka wrote:
human wrote:Her book is actually called "thoughts of the mad" or something like that, a title I find horrendously inappropriate on many levels.
I agree. The title made me think it might be about her struggles with mental illness (I have no idea if she has any mental illnesses, I just thought she might from the title) and I think the title would have been okay for an own voices book about how to deal with this stuff. But it's "just" a Youtube memoir and the title is really inappropriate in that context.

I can't really decide what I think about Dodie anymore. I used to find her pretentious, then I started liking her a bit and now I'm back to finding her pretentious after looking through her instagram. I don't know what she's like in real life but her internet presence isn't my cup of tea at all. She's a great songwriter but her overall image just irks me these days. Her obsession with the colour yellow is a good example I think, I don't like how she acts like she invented it.
The books is called "Secrets for the Mad". (She also has a song called Secret for the Mad.) She does seem to badly suffer from mental illness. It seems like she thinks about it too much and it's hurting her mental state. People are saying they think writing a book would be therapeutic, but I feel like it might be making it worse.

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Re: Dodie

Post by jaej » Wed Jun 21, 2017 1:49 pm

i feel like the average 20ish year old just doesn't have enough to write about and that it could just like... fit into a video or blog post? like she makes already? "i feel sad sometimes but now i've decided to be positive uwu, sometimes i fought with my family but we love each other, sometimes people aren't good so you need to make new friends" i guess her target audience is young and i suppose when i was 13 any adulty person who sort of knew what they were doing a BIT sounded like a genius to me but a lot of these books feel a bit like a pat on the back for existing

but in general the whole "uwu i'm a smol flower i love tea and ukuleles u are all so beautiful oh gosh" annoys me so i'm not really starting on a good foot with her. i think she's friends on some level with simply_kenna which isn't that surprising, bleugh.

also her newest instagram post, or at least the one most recently recommended to me, has her talking about the effects of antidepressants after 2/3 days which worries me because it just indicates she really does not understand how they work or how quickly and understanding how long they take to kick in is an important part of starting medication. so i hope if her knowledge on other aspects of mental illness is the same then she won't write about that so much
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Re: Dodie

Post by Katka » Wed Jun 21, 2017 2:36 pm

onetruetrash wrote:The books is called "Secrets for the Mad". (She also has a song called Secret for the Mad.) She does seem to badly suffer from mental illness. It seems like she thinks about it too much and it's hurting her mental state. People are saying they think writing a book would be therapeutic, but I feel like it might be making it worse.
I don't know, that title isn't much better and it's still just a memoir. The book's subtitle seems to be "Obsessions, Confessions and Life Lessons" and that sums up my problem with Dodie quite well. She's 22. What kind of life lessons does she have to share at that age? Most people don't even have their own lives figured out at 22, they shouldn't try and help others out. I know I'm generalising here but I hate that Youtube trend of very young people pretending like they've got it all together and selling their "life lessons" to teenagers. I just don't think wealthy early 20s have that much valuable experience to share that they haven't already shared in a vlog or two. (At least the price of the book went down to £14,99 now, which is still a lot of money for that little content.)

Don't get me wrong, I'm not really against Youtuber memoirs alltogether. I love Tyler's for instance and even though I haven't read it yet, Hannah Hart's new book looks great. It's just this kind of memoir that bugs me. I feel the same about Connor Franta's two memoirs actually. What exactly can these kids teach other kids or adults? Or is it all just pretty empty words, like jaej described? The reason I'm this salty about it is that it seems like money grabbing to me. Write some stuff, it doesn't have to be all that meaningful, the kids will buy it and think it's so deep.
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Re: Dodie

Post by sparkle » Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:01 pm

Katka wrote:
I don't know, that title isn't much better and it's still just a memoir. The book's subtitle seems to be "Obsessions, Confessions and Life Lessons" and that sums up my problem with Dodie quite well. She's 22. What kind of life lessons does she have to share at that age? Most people don't even have their own lives figured out at 22, they shouldn't try and help others out. I know I'm generalising here but I hate that Youtube trend of very young people pretending like they've got it all together and selling their "life lessons" to teenagers. I just don't think wealthy early 20s have that much valuable experience to share that they haven't already shared in a vlog or two. (At least the price of the book went down to £14,99 now, which is still a lot of money for that little content.)

Don't get me wrong, I'm not really against Youtuber memoirs alltogether. I love Tyler's for instance and even though I haven't read it yet, Hannah Hart's new book looks great. It's just this kind of memoir that bugs me. I feel the same about Connor Franta's two memoirs actually. What exactly can these kids teach other kids or adults? Or is it all just pretty empty words, like jaej described? The reason I'm this salty about it is that it seems like money grabbing to me. Write some stuff, it doesn't have to be all that meaningful, the kids will buy it and think it's so deep.
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I'm only a few weeks younger than Dodie, and though I haven't had the opportunities she has had through youtube, I still struggle to see how anyone my age could write a book on their life. I have a few 'life lessons' that I would love to impart to my 16 year old self, but not enough to fill a book; it'd be cool if she wrote a book on what music means to her or something? But life lessons, idk. Even a few of my fellow 22 year olds who have done some pretty big things like lived in foreign countries or run their own businesses I think would struggle to fill a good sized book. Memoirs can be cool - but I think semi-autobiographical, or even just talking about a topic you really love and relating it to your life would be better than a memoir.

Saying that, I've never really liked Dodie, I've always found her a little bit too saccharine and insipid. And I'm not a huge fan of her music either, it's not bad it's just that it's not for me. Nothing personally against her, I do think she's talented, she's just not the sort of YouTuber I like.
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Re: Dodie

Post by 000dia000 » Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:11 pm

I have to admit, I'm not as engaged as I used to be with Dodie, I'm a little turned off by her fandom more so. People's insistence to pair her with Dan and wish for them to collab annoys me, mostly because I don't think they have anything in common, yet people want to see their favs together because they're pretty.

However, while I find that Dodie is young and hasn't exactly "lived" enough to gain valuable, real-world experience, she can still write an interesting book on mental health. It may not be content for an adult audience but may be beneficial for those who are young, struggling, and have people telling them "they aren't depressed enough". Also, I get unreasonable bitter when people insinuate that Dodie is playing up her mental health. It isn't a competition. There's obviously a lot more beneath the surface, if you watch her video "angry" she discusses very clearly sexual assault and relationship issues that have affected her self-esteem. She just doesn't broadcast reasons because, well, who would want to talk about stuff like that so much? I agree that putting herself out there may not be the best, but for all we know may be therapeutic. I feel like a lot of her audience really connect with her and feel less alone to have someone be very openly sad.

Calling her pretentious is one thing, and to each their own. But openly criticizing someone for their mental health? Jesus Christ IDB
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Re: Dodie

Post by Katka » Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:28 pm

000dia000 wrote:Calling her pretentious is one thing, and to each their own. But openly criticizing someone for their mental health? Jesus Christ IDB
Maybe I missed it but when did that happen?

If the book was on mental health, I'd love it actually because that's something she has experienced and own voices books on these topics are super important. I wouldn't find the title inappropriate at all if it was indeed about her struggles with mental illness and the "life lessons" part was about how she lives with it. But it looks like a regular Youtuber memoir and I'm pretty sure it's going to be one. We'll have to wait and see, I guess, maybe she'll surprise us after all.
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Re: Dodie

Post by fondsmiles » Wed Jun 21, 2017 8:00 pm

000dia000 wrote: However, while I find that Dodie is young and hasn't exactly "lived" enough to gain valuable, real-world experience, she can still write an interesting book on mental health. It may not be content for an adult audience but may be beneficial for those who are young, struggling, and have people telling them "they aren't depressed enough". Also, I get unreasonable bitter when people insinuate that Dodie is playing up her mental health. It isn't a competition. There's obviously a lot more beneath the surface, if you watch her video "angry" she discusses very clearly sexual assault and relationship issues that have affected her self-esteem. She just doesn't broadcast reasons because, well, who would want to talk about stuff like that so much? I agree that putting herself out there may not be the best, but for all we know may be therapeutic. I feel like a lot of her audience really connect with her and feel less alone to have someone be very openly sad.

Calling her pretentious is one thing, and to each their own. But openly criticizing someone for their mental health? Jesus Christ IDB
thank you for this. reading some of the posts here made my stomach churn uncomfortably, and you put a lot of what I felt in words.

I was at Vidcon EU, and there was a panel called "A Conversation About Mental Health" (it was really really good, featuring TomSka and Beckie Brown (?) and Dodie, moderated by Kati Morton) and I really appreciated hearing them all talk about this. Dodie states clearly that she has mental health problems, and making it seem like she talks about it too much, or plays it up, or is just a slightly sad young person who exploits that to appeal to others - that is very toxic. Some of the symptoms she's shared openly also almost always stem from more serious issues beyond that, which I won't get into, but - just because she doesn't share her reasons doesn't mean there aren't any.

On the topic on her book: I am not too invested with her, I casually watch those videos of her that interest me, and I probably won't get it. But I think that someone her age can definitely bring out some kind of memoir. Obviously it won't be about the whole life, obviously it won't be able to share the most important lessons she'll ever make (because some of those she hasn't made yet), and maybe some of her wording and approach aren't ideal. But with 22 you've experienced many things already, experiences in puberty alone could fill a whole book and one that could seriously help people out. Also, different people experience things in differing intensity, so she might have more to share than some others her age.
In my opinion, a memoir/auto-biography doesn't have to include the whole life or the most important things looking back at your whole life. It can be a snapshot of things you've learned and experienced so far, and I personally really like reading those type of books. Sometimes especially from younger people, people my age, who get into the topics that are currently my life in much more detail than they would if they looked back on it from a more mature level of experience.
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Re: Dodie

Post by jaej » Wed Jun 21, 2017 8:45 pm

Katka wrote:
000dia000 wrote:Calling her pretentious is one thing, and to each their own. But openly criticizing someone for their mental health? Jesus Christ IDB
Maybe I missed it but when did that happen?
quoting this because i am also confused :?
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Re: Dodie

Post by Katka » Thu Jun 22, 2017 12:54 am

I just wanna make it very clear that I’m happy for everyone on here who enjoys her content and if you’re going to read her book, please tell me what you think about it. I do find Dodie pretentious, she’s not my cup of tea at all, but she’s a good person and a good songwriter and I wish her all the best, whether I like her online presence (I don’t know her as a person after all, maybe she’s all different) or not. I’ll watch some more videos of hers on mental illness tomorrow and if someone knows whether her panel on mental illness in Amsterdam can be watched online somewhere, I’d be really thankful because I’d like to watch that too.

Just felt like saying this after being very negative about her today. I really appreciate her frankness when it comes to “difficult” topics and I do think her vlogs and her talking about them can help people out, I just don’t see why it has to be a book now too. But yeah, all the best to her. I don’t have to like the book or her channel or whatever but I do wish her well. I sometimes feel like I can’t stress this enough when I criticise someone. Just because I don’t like what they’re doing doesn’t mean I don’t want them to be happy and successful. Um, yeah, pointless post is pointless, just wanted to make that clear since it’s not always a given on the internet.
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Re: Dodie

Post by onetruetrash » Thu Jun 22, 2017 3:48 am

jaej wrote:
Katka wrote:
000dia000 wrote:Calling her pretentious is one thing, and to each their own. But openly criticizing someone for their mental health? Jesus Christ IDB
Maybe I missed it but when did that happen?
quoting this because i am also confused :?
Yeah, I don't recall anyone saying she was wrong for having mental health issues.

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Re: Dodie

Post by onetruetrash » Thu Jul 06, 2017 4:14 pm

A new EP already? Wow. Lots of people wanted of though, so it makes sense. I hope this one is as good as the last one.

Here's the track listing. Sounds good to me!

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Re: Dodie

Post by lualey » Fri Jul 07, 2017 10:02 pm

This morning I saw this tweet from her manager and apparently this is from UK Itunes, also she is currently #3 in america.
I'm impressed, I didn't know that many people followed her (at least in UK) like to put Kesha or Coldplay behind. She has a very active presence online, good for her. :thumb:

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Re: Dodie

Post by thephandommenace » Thu Jul 20, 2017 3:49 pm

I hope the shoot for "You" goes well though I'm a bit nervous as I don't want every single video to be some great symbolic masterpiece where it'll turn dark unexpectedly and then when people complain she'll just say "you didn't get the song then" or smth. I loved the video for 'Intertwined' but I'd never paid the song much attention before seeing the video so the video piqued my interest. This time however I've already listened to 'You' and formed an opinion on it so I'm bracing myself. On one hand I say 'yay production value!' (Paris and Bertie and stuff) and on the other hand I dread the oncoming storm of pretentiousness. I enjoy Dodie but she can get annoying sometimes. (I never read her instagram posts and I turned on Twitter notifs for her the other day but I might end up turning them off again.) A lot of my feelings probably stem from jealousy though. And I don't mind her being pretentious too much as she definitely delivers on the art front. I genuinely really enjoy her music. Sorry for this useless post.

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Re: Dodie

Post by MythicalPinkTrashCan » Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:33 pm

I'm listening to her music for the first time ever, and I'm very surprised by her music, and not in a good way. It reminds me of how Wizard Rock sounded back in the day (before it all came crashing down). Very I made this in my room on garage band and I'm so quirky that's why I play the ukulele.

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Re: Dodie

Post by alittledizzy » Sat Jul 22, 2017 4:12 am

MythicalPinkTrashCan wrote:
I'm listening to her music for the first time ever, and I'm very surprised by her music, and not in a good way. It reminds me of how Wizard Rock sounded back in the day (before it all came crashing down). Very I made this in my room on garage band and I'm so quirky that's why I play the ukulele.
Oh damn, you just nailed how I feel about her sound, too. I am constantly surprised by how strong a response she gets. Not that I'm judging anyone for it; I was super into wizard rock for a few years there around the time the last couple HP books were coming out!

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Re: Dodie

Post by MythicalPinkTrashCan » Sat Jul 22, 2017 3:05 pm

alittledizzy wrote:
MythicalPinkTrashCan wrote:
I'm listening to her music for the first time ever, and I'm very surprised by her music, and not in a good way. It reminds me of how Wizard Rock sounded back in the day (before it all came crashing down). Very I made this in my room on garage band and I'm so quirky that's why I play the ukulele.
Oh damn, you just nailed how I feel about her sound, too. I am constantly surprised by how strong a response she gets. Not that I'm judging anyone for it; I was super into wizard rock for a few years there around the time the last couple HP books were coming out!
Maybe that's what it is? Is her demo the same as wizard rock was? (teens out to have fun) Perfect for teens who are starting to explore the world and she doesn't sound like what's on the radio, that means she's better type of thing?

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Re: Dodie

Post by captainspacecoat » Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:04 pm

This video and the responses to it are fascinating to me (trigger warning for discussion of depression, suicide and panic attacks):

I very much agree with Zannah's text - I've recently found Dodie's intensely personal discussion of her mental state to be really damaging to my own mental health, and as such have distanced myself from most of her social media sites. Not because I don't sympathise with her - I definitely do - but because it sometimes feels inappropriate given how young and impressionable much of her audience are. I fully support her right to discuss mental health frankly and openly, and I think any attempt to reduce stigma surrounding mental illness is wonderful, but when Dodie talks about feeling like there's no point to life (and not in a joking way a la Dan) or writes essays on instagram about how hopeless she feels paired with a pretty aesthetic picture, it kind of just feels hopeless and scary and futile as there's nothing her young audience can do but spam her comments with messages of unconditional love and support.

I was really intrigued by how honest people are being in the comments, and how many people feel this way about Dodie's oversharing. Especially the ones talking about the romanticisation of mental illness, and how many of Dodie's younger viewers convinced themselves that they too were mentally ill. There seems to be a consensus that while discussion of mental health online is super important, it can be damaging when no solution is offered, or when romanticised/equated with a certain 'aesthetic.

I'm super glad Zannah sent Dodie that text (very mature and kind of her, she sounds like a great friend honestly), and I think this was a really important video for Dodie to make. Although, I was kind of frustrated by Dodie and Hazel's remarks that "creatives" tend to be depressed, as I feel like that's a dangerous assumption to make and also erases the fact that depression doesn't discriminate - there are plenty of people who aren't """"creatives"""" and are very mentally unwell. Felt kind of pretentious.

Anyway, I would definitely recommend watching the vid/checking out the comments! I also want to clarify that I don't have a problem with Dodie talking about mental illness online - I think it's great! I just think it's important that she's responsible and considerate in going about it. That doesn't mean she needs to gloss over the more uncomfortable or upsetting aspects, but it does mean she needs to consider that her audience are not counsellors - they are human beings (many of them under 18) with issues and lives of their own. It can be dangerous to think of your audience as a therapist, and I'm glad Dodie has good friends who will hopefully be of more help to her than her youtube viewers.

What do you guys think?

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Re: Dodie

Post by onetruetrash » Tue Jul 25, 2017 2:56 pm

I thought this was interesting.

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Re: Dodie

Post by flarequake » Tue Jul 25, 2017 3:59 pm

Her song Dear Happy is the one I like the most, I can take or leave most of her music, but I find them all, especially that one, very heartfelt and sweet. She probably has enough to say that her audience would like to read, though if she left it another 5-10 years she'd obviously have more and probably write it from a different perspective. She's one of the crowd who've been around quite a while and done a few things to get to where they are now.

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Re: Dodie

Post by fondsmiles » Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:32 pm

captainspacecoat wrote: I very much agree with Zannah's text - I've recently found Dodie's intensely personal discussion of her mental state to be really damaging to my own mental health, and as such have distanced myself from most of her social media sites. Not because I don't sympathise with her - I definitely do - but because it sometimes feels inappropriate given how young and impressionable much of her audience are. I fully support her right to discuss mental health frankly and openly, and I think any attempt to reduce stigma surrounding mental illness is wonderful, but when Dodie talks about feeling like there's no point to life (and not in a joking way a la Dan) or writes essays on instagram about how hopeless she feels paired with a pretty aesthetic picture, it kind of just feels hopeless and scary and futile as there's nothing her young audience can do but spam her comments with messages of unconditional love and support.

I was really intrigued by how honest people are being in the comments, and how many people feel this way about Dodie's oversharing. Especially the ones talking about the romanticisation of mental illness, and how many of Dodie's younger viewers convinced themselves that they too were mentally ill. There seems to be a consensus that while discussion of mental health online is super important, it can be damaging when no solution is offered, or when romanticised/equated with a certain 'aesthetic.

I'm super glad Zannah sent Dodie that text (very mature and kind of her, she sounds like a great friend honestly), and I think this was a really important video for Dodie to make.
I don't watch Dodie's stuff that consistently. to hear about this amount and the personal details that she's sharing have definitely surprised me.

It was a very good video, very interesting to me just because it talks about how people deal with sharing mental health, and I found the aspects of how it can be easier to reach out without specific intent to a huge amount of people, instead of actually making the leap and asking someone specific to be there for you.
I also really found the text from the friend great, I am glad they did that. I totally agree that it may be feeling good for her to do it in the moment, and that it is important to talk about mental health and your journey if you're feeling up for it, but that it probably should be a bit more distanced, because letting a big group of people unsupervised in into those very dark places can be not only harmful for you, but also very much for them. I think Dodie does see that now, so I am really glad someone braved it and told her about it.

the video made me think a lot. so it's good, definitely. videos that make you think are always good in my book.
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Re: Dodie

Post by opendoor » Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:21 am

MythicalPinkTrashCan wrote:
alittledizzy wrote:
MythicalPinkTrashCan wrote:
I'm listening to her music for the first time ever, and I'm very surprised by her music, and not in a good way. It reminds me of how Wizard Rock sounded back in the day (before it all came crashing down). Very I made this in my room on garage band and I'm so quirky that's why I play the ukulele.
Oh damn, you just nailed how I feel about her sound, too. I am constantly surprised by how strong a response she gets. Not that I'm judging anyone for it; I was super into wizard rock for a few years there around the time the last couple HP books were coming out!
Maybe that's what it is? Is her demo the same as wizard rock was? (teens out to have fun) Perfect for teens who are starting to explore the world and she doesn't sound like what's on the radio, that means she's better type of thing?
I think it's exactly that- I know I was really into youtuber music when I was fourteen for that reason, but it sounds a bit shit now. I'm really not a fan of Dodie's voice/music. I get a bit ??? when other youtubers compliment it.

Her vlogs are not for me but I'm obviously fine with them being out there and people enjoying them, I just personally hope she never collabs with dnp. And that is probably the most negative thing I've put on the Internet recently, so I'll temper it by saying at least she seems like a good person who cares about her audience. There we go.
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Re: Dodie

Post by Katka » Wed Jul 26, 2017 10:40 am

I was never into wizard rock at all so I don't know what it sounds like but Dodie's music sounds like mid to late noughties anti-folk to me. I used to be really into that in like 2009 and that low-fi sound with mumbled, somewhat weird and quirky lyrics was kind of cool in indie music back then. Like Kimya Dawson's sound on "Knock Knock Who?" from 2004 for example. That's what Dodie reminds me of and maybe that's why I instantly liked it (not enough to buy it though, probably because I have all these records from about ten years ago already, idk?). But I agree that her music sounds kind of dated. It's definitely something that was kind of prevalent in indie folk and indie music in general ten years ago and maybe that's another reason why it sounds different and new again to modern day teens, they just weren't around when anti-folk (and wizard rock?) happened back then?
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Re: Dodie

Post by MythicalPinkTrashCan » Thu Jul 27, 2017 8:53 pm

Katka wrote:I was never into wizard rock at all so I don't know what it sounds like but Dodie's music sounds like mid to late noughties anti-folk to me. I used to be really into that in like 2009 and that low-fi sound with mumbled, somewhat weird and quirky lyrics was kind of cool in indie music back then. Like Kimya Dawson's sound on "Knock Knock Who?" from 2004 for example. That's what Dodie reminds me of and maybe that's why I instantly liked it (not enough to buy it though, probably because I have all these records from about ten years ago already, idk?). But I agree that her music sounds kind of dated. It's definitely something that was kind of prevalent in indie folk and indie music in general ten years ago and maybe that's another reason why it sounds different and new again to modern day teens, they just weren't around when anti-folk (and wizard rock?) happened back then?
Wrock sounded like Kimya Dawson, but like a bad version of it haha

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Re: Dodie

Post by onetruetrash » Sun Aug 13, 2017 1:50 pm

What do y'all think of her new EP?

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