Re Dan's video, I liked it! Didn't like LOVE it, I thought some parts could be shorter and he could've addressed other memes (he's also using the word meme really lightly let's say) but overall I think solid video. Kinda happy he's not going to do another one, but I'm not mad at it.
I'm extremely glad he included the ladydoor song, I found it a couple of weeks ago and I died laughing. My first reaction was exactly like Dan's and then it got stuck in my head. I wish he would've called Phil in the room and showed him I'm camera.
I know people will say it's not Dan's style but what I wish from 2018 is the return of a derpy and preppy collab on Dan's channel, besides the baking video. It prob won't happen. Thank god we have the actual king of content that gives people what they really want, Phil Lester.
Also the mention of the depression video my heart always melts.
I'm now ready for gaming videos, and return of normal main channel videos.
@alittledizzy oh my god please tweet Phil with that idea I would actually pay
Dan & Phil Part 64: Poptropica 2: Dragon #SPON
- obsessivelymoody
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alittledizzy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:01 pmokay though, what a phil idea??blackdenim wrote: ↑Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:59 pmImagine if Fabergé sent Phil a back-egg, I would die to watch that #spon video.
"sponsors choose my outfit!"
he gets a fun video concept, and also rakes in the cash on the back end because each outfit - plus accessories - are paid promo.
*enters thread 20 hours late without Starbucks*
I didn't hate it but I'm glad this was the last meme/year in review video. It was so long though, and it didn't feel necessary for it to be. I kinda got bored halfway through hence why I'm so late with posting.
Anyway here's that commentary nobody ordered:
- 33 MINUTES?? He really knows how to get us out of a drought huh? Little shit.
- Aw Dan. Gettin my hopes up and crushing them with disappointment wasn't just the theme in 2017, that's just been the theme for the past 5 years of stanning.
- Is he just gonna drag the phandom for the obsession with Soft Dan for 33 minutes? I can't hate that.
- Oh look a millisecond of a BTS member. RIP to his comment section. Also your hair inspiration was SHINee not BTS, they're not even from the emo hair era.
- I know a lot of people suddenly felt all guilty over making That Week In March a thing after it was revealed what it was but he should've known better than dropping something like that on us professionally obnoxious people.
- Dragging Shane Dawson's dumbass conspiracy video.
- I forgot that the phandom has to find something else to be extra about this April Fool's.
- I was into that #FreeTheKnee selfie until I saw what that shirt actually looked like when he was standing up tbh.
- "A lot of the things I did that year were with Phil." is the less iconic dollar store reboot of "I spend most of 2016 with another person."
- Didn't the dramatic sadness last for all but 5 minutes before people were just ecstatic about D&P moving into their 3rd shared flat though?
- "It's just a bloody name!!" You were the one being extra about it sis.
- Raise your hand if you think that profile pic is far more cringe than dani snot on fire ever was.
- 2017 made getting your food roasted by Gordon Ramsey a bigger achievement than getting him to like it, what a year.
- New appartment angle?
- Ok but Bahama Gate was the best entertainment that Dan provided us with in 2017. It was an experience, like one of those detective games on Twitter but real and without the murder.
- But didn't you explicitly say Phil wasn't the one who took the donut picture? All men do is lie.
- God of Serotonin Deficiency remains iconic.
- This is just #spon disguised as a ~funny thing that happened this year~ lmao. Capita£ester who?
- DEATH TO LADY DOOR. I hope future gaming livestream chats keep that shit in 2017.
- What a totally genuine reaction to a video he is definitely only just seeing for the first time because he's not a control freak at all. /sarcasm
- So your family all had a slice, but Colin ate half the entire cake... I know my math is shit but that doesn't add up. Anyway, that was truly the best way to end the year.
- I miss the explosion and dramatic music as his end screen. I really don't like the new one
I do wonder how he'll kick off the year in 2019 now. Or will they have retired by then?
Love dizzy's video idea!
I didn't hate it but I'm glad this was the last meme/year in review video. It was so long though, and it didn't feel necessary for it to be. I kinda got bored halfway through hence why I'm so late with posting.
Anyway here's that commentary nobody ordered:
- 33 MINUTES?? He really knows how to get us out of a drought huh? Little shit.
- Aw Dan. Gettin my hopes up and crushing them with disappointment wasn't just the theme in 2017, that's just been the theme for the past 5 years of stanning.
- Is he just gonna drag the phandom for the obsession with Soft Dan for 33 minutes? I can't hate that.
- Oh look a millisecond of a BTS member. RIP to his comment section. Also your hair inspiration was SHINee not BTS, they're not even from the emo hair era.
- I know a lot of people suddenly felt all guilty over making That Week In March a thing after it was revealed what it was but he should've known better than dropping something like that on us professionally obnoxious people.
- Dragging Shane Dawson's dumbass conspiracy video.
- I was into that #FreeTheKnee selfie until I saw what that shirt actually looked like when he was standing up tbh.
- "A lot of the things I did that year were with Phil." is the less iconic dollar store reboot of "I spend most of 2016 with another person."
- Didn't the dramatic sadness last for all but 5 minutes before people were just ecstatic about D&P moving into their 3rd shared flat though?
- "It's just a bloody name!!" You were the one being extra about it sis.
- Raise your hand if you think that profile pic is far more cringe than dani snot on fire ever was.
- 2017 made getting your food roasted by Gordon Ramsey a bigger achievement than getting him to like it, what a year.
- New appartment angle?
- Ok but Bahama Gate was the best entertainment that Dan provided us with in 2017. It was an experience, like one of those detective games on Twitter but real and without the murder.
- But didn't you explicitly say Phil wasn't the one who took the donut picture? All men do is lie.
- God of Serotonin Deficiency remains iconic.
- This is just #spon disguised as a ~funny thing that happened this year~ lmao. Capita£ester who?
- DEATH TO LADY DOOR. I hope future gaming livestream chats keep that shit in 2017.
- What a totally genuine reaction to a video he is definitely only just seeing for the first time because he's not a control freak at all. /sarcasm
- So your family all had a slice, but Colin ate half the entire cake... I know my math is shit but that doesn't add up. Anyway, that was truly the best way to end the year.
- I miss the explosion and dramatic music as his end screen. I really don't like the new one
I do wonder how he'll kick off the year in 2019 now. Or will they have retired by then?
Imagine Phil actually snatching up some Fabergé spon omg
Love dizzy's video idea!
Looks like the gaming channel will be revived this week, yay!
I’m reading the twitter replies and it seems like everyone is demanding Dream Daddy. I’m still not over those two abandoning it.
My guess is they’ll start off 2018 with a bang and give us what we all really, really want - another flash game! Hooray i’m not bitter at ALL
I’m reading the twitter replies and it seems like everyone is demanding Dream Daddy. I’m still not over those two abandoning it.
My guess is they’ll start off 2018 with a bang and give us what we all really, really want - another flash game! Hooray i’m not bitter at ALL
»»-————𝓯𝓵𝓸𝓹𝓹𝔂 𝓭𝓲𝓷𝓰 𝓭𝓸𝓷𝓰————-««
- autumnhearth
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Sipping my first Ribena. I like it.
(yay original red currant at the import store!)
Yes I literally just came here to use that emoji.
(yay original red currant at the import store!)
Yes I literally just came here to use that emoji.
I gave up on them continuing DD a while back, although I could be wrong and judging by their undertale series they can take forever with their let's plays. It just seems like they so obviously DGAF about it anymore, so would the vid even be good if they did it?
Also I'm just going to assume that by "this week" they'll be back on the gaming channel, they really mean next saturday, knowing them. I'm trying not to get my hopes up for anything sooner
Edit:figured i'd include the tweet for context
"He's the guy with his flesh on show. What a hoe.
That's. Our. Dan."
That's. Our. Dan."
- blackdenim
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I agree with everyone else that this is an absolutely AMAZING video idea. Phil, take note if you're reading.alittledizzy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:01 pmokay though, what a phil idea??blackdenim wrote: ↑Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:59 pmImagine if Fabergé sent Phil a back-egg, I would die to watch that #spon video.
"sponsors choose my outfit!"
he gets a fun video concept, and also rakes in the cash on the back end because each outfit - plus accessories - are paid promo.
If Phil doesn't do this I can totally see Safiya Nygaard (who as you prob all know is my number 1 youtube crush ) doing it and I am here for either tbh.
- alittledizzy
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I hope people are sending Phil some realistic-but-good suggestions. My gaming expertise is limited, I have nothing I'm invested in seeing them play, I just want that sweet sweet content.
Seconded - though I'd love to see Safiya do basically anything, tbh.blackdenim wrote: ↑Mon Jan 15, 2018 10:58 pmIf Phil doesn't do this I can totally see Safiya Nygaard (who as you prob all know is my number 1 youtube crush ) doing it and I am here for either tbh.
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I really hope they do a small series of other platform games. I loved the Donkey Kong series so much and also the Crash Bandicoot video so I am hoping they actually play something proper like this that doesn’t involve too much of them reading from the screen and is just them playing a fun platform game. Nothing better than just watching them both playing something that is a little challenging.
I would also love them to play walk the plank on VR but it would definitely make Phil throw up! It’s so good.
@blackdenim glad you like the avatar, it’s been up since around Christmas I think!
I would also love them to play walk the plank on VR but it would definitely make Phil throw up! It’s so good.
@blackdenim glad you like the avatar, it’s been up since around Christmas I think!
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same id really like to see them play more 'proper' games like more xbox, ps4 game like cod or gta but i can see why they wouldnt since most of their audience wont be into it.missemma wrote: ↑Mon Jan 15, 2018 11:22 pm I really hope they do a small series of other platform games. I loved the Donkey Kong series so much and also the Crash Bandicoot video so I am hoping they actually play something proper like this that doesn’t involve too much of them reading from the screen and is just them playing a fun platform game. Nothing better than just watching them both playing something that is a little challenging.
I would also love them to play walk the plank on VR but it would definitely make Phil throw up! It’s so good.
I liked the video even though it definitely could have used some trimming. But then again I’m so starved for Dan content that I didn’t even mind the extra 10 minutes (except for the parts that included unnecessary screeching) and enough of it made me actually lol that I'm glad it exists. But I really hate the grammar non-joke that he and he alone perpetuated all year, that segment did not need to be in there only because I personally hate it, but I guess it was about as much of a meme as the majority of what he included in his mislabelled ‘year in review’ video (I say with love). No more meme vids, no more Crafts, deprioritizing liveshows, disappearing in a few months for tour… I liked the video, but the full picture of things beyond the video and the year to come has kind of bummed me out. I just hear death knells. (YES I’M FUN AT PARTIES, STOP ASKING).
I’ve been catching up on YT vids today and this one felt kind of thematically relevant, since every dinof upload brings about more persona talk (to be fair, so does a sneeze):
6:55 - “I’m not just talking - I am talking - but I’m not just being fully open with you guys about everything. Of course I’m not. ‘Cause it’s YT, and this is a persona. It’s me, but it is a persona. When a YTer says or does something, it’s their persona doing it.”
“That’s what you’re doing when you are a YTer, you are creating this character that people can view."
And just for boring anecdotal purposes since I’m here anyway: my parents' house has 2 fireplaces that have never once been used in +10yrs and it gets really flipping cold here, colder than anything going on in London (for example, earlier today it was almost -40 with the wind chill!) so. Nothing means anything, sometimes.
I’ve been catching up on YT vids today and this one felt kind of thematically relevant, since every dinof upload brings about more persona talk (to be fair, so does a sneeze):
“That’s what you’re doing when you are a YTer, you are creating this character that people can view."
Thanks and have a great day! Oil me
- autumnhearth
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Wow fancybum that is what I call some in-depth analysis. I’m just kind of in awe and have nothing specific I feel like I can reply to at the moment, except of course the last and least important part. I admit that I’m definitely projecting with the fireplace thing. Hearths are about atmosphere as much as function for me, though boy I wish I had a functioning one. I think I am going to give the vid another shot in the near future, the husband said he might be up for watching it.
fancybum, that really was an in-depth (heh) analysis!
(I wish there was a system to like posts so I don't have to awkwardly formulate a reply when I'm trying to agree with someone haha)
Since I'm yet to chip in on the new video, I thought it was great! I think I laughed a few points. Also, I like Dan's mentions of 2017 being a year of personal growth. I'm genuinely so proud of him for all he's done in 2017, and I hope 2018 will be good to him
(I wish there was a system to like posts so I don't have to awkwardly formulate a reply when I'm trying to agree with someone haha)
Since I'm yet to chip in on the new video, I thought it was great! I think I laughed a few points. Also, I like Dan's mentions of 2017 being a year of personal growth. I'm genuinely so proud of him for all he's done in 2017, and I hope 2018 will be good to him
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I liked your whole post, but just copying this part to shorten and because it's a good summary. I don't have much more to add, just wanted to say that I agree with this. I was having this conversation outside of idb earlier. People can not like Dan and that's fine, but it's a bit frustrating when people don't like Dan because they have a different version of him in their mind. Dan is, has been, and probably always will be a sarcastic, semi-nilihist, 'dark', self-deprecating person. That's who he is. And he may exaggerate parts of those characteristics for comedy and sometimes as a defense mechanism, but that doesn't make any of it a lie or a full-on 'persona'. And he's not completely that person either - there are 'soft' sides of Dan, and he may not choose to show those sides as often, especially not on dinof. But he really is a sarcastic, self-deprecating person, and I don't mind him choosing to highlight that side of himself on his channel.fancybum wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 12:12 am His self-deprecation and semi-nihilistic view of the world are not just an invention for his ~persona~, they are part of him. I know no one was necessarily making the argument that those qualities are completely fake, but I just keep seeing the idea that he should drop his self-deprecation and ~negativity since he’s rebranded and opened up about his mental health, as if those things should entirely change his core personality. And his persona is just an exaggerated version of parts of his personality that he thinks will be (because they always have been) the most entertaining:
- alittledizzy
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(Even as I hit submit on this post I realize there is literally no original thought contained within, but what are forums for if not sharing the same opinion once a month.)whatdoiknow wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 1:37 amI liked your whole post, but just copying this part to shorten and because it's a good summary. I don't have much more to add, just wanted to say that I agree with this. I was having this conversation outside of idb earlier. People can not like Dan and that's fine, but it's a bit frustrating when people don't like Dan because they have a different version of him in their mind. Dan is, has been, and probably always will be a sarcastic, semi-nilihist, 'dark', self-deprecating person. That's who he is. And he may exaggerate parts of those characteristics for comedy and sometimes as a defense mechanism, but that doesn't make any of it a lie or a full-on 'persona'. And he's not completely that person either - there are 'soft' sides of Dan, and he may not choose to show those sides as often, especially not on dinof. But he really is a sarcastic, self-deprecating person, and I don't mind him choosing to highlight that side of himself on his channel.fancybum wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 12:12 am His self-deprecation and semi-nihilistic view of the world are not just an invention for his ~persona~, they are part of him. I know no one was necessarily making the argument that those qualities are completely fake, but I just keep seeing the idea that he should drop his self-deprecation and ~negativity since he’s rebranded and opened up about his mental health, as if those things should entirely change his core personality. And his persona is just an exaggerated version of parts of his personality that he thinks will be (because they always have been) the most entertaining:
So I do agree with this, but I do want to specify that in my mind there's a difference between Dan being genuinely self-deprecating and negative and in Dan reacting with an exaggerated tone of self-deprecation or negativity to something that was a setup he himself put in place (which is the part of his video that made me eyeroll).
Also, it doesn't enamor me to him when he acts as though people reacting to the 'softer side of Sears' are fabricating something that isn't really there. He can preach about how he really is that dark depressing guy, and I believe that, because people are nuanced and he can be many things - but he's acting like we don't all remember how he spent half the year talking to his liveshow audience in soft voices telling us it'll all be okay and taking us through breathing exercises in his liveshows and reminding us we're all valid and important no matter how we are. That's the specific disconnect between main channel Dan and everywhere-else-Dan that doesn't gel with me. And I understand he does it because liveshows are a niche audience and his main channel is not, but still. It draws from my enjoyment. /kanyeshrug
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(that's my thought basically every time I post something lol but here's some more redundant thought)alittledizzy wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 1:57 am(Even as I hit submit on this post I realize there is literally no original thought contained within, but what are forums for if not sharing the same opinion once a month.)
So I do agree with this, but I do want to specify that in my mind there's a difference between Dan being genuinely self-deprecating and negative and in Dan reacting with an exaggerated tone of self-deprecation or negativity to something that was a setup he himself put in place (which is the part of his video that made me eyeroll).
Also, it doesn't enamor me to him when he acts as though people reacting to the 'softer side of Sears' are fabricating something that isn't really there. He can preach about how he really is that dark depressing guy, and I believe that, because people are nuanced and he can be many things - but he's acting like we don't all remember how he spent half the year talking to his liveshow audience in soft voices telling us it'll all be okay and taking us through breathing exercises in his liveshows and reminding us we're all valid and important no matter how we are. That's the specific disconnect between main channel Dan and everywhere-else-Dan that doesn't gel with me. And I understand he does it because liveshows are a niche audience and his main channel is not, but still. It draws from my enjoyment. /kanyeshrug
I do agree with your point. My comment was more about people who think Dan's entire self-deprecating personality is fake or an exaggeration. I do think with scripted dinof content, he can over-exaggerate aspects of that personality at times, and I don't always find that very entertaining. But, as a whole, I enjoy his sarcastic, self-deprecating comedy (and that's what drew me to him in the first place) - it just doesn't hit the mark every time.
I actually didn't think of the whole "softer side" denial in that way when I watched the video (it didn't cross my mind at all), but I can see where you're coming from now. For me, I just saw it as him joking around (while also being a bit serious), stressing to his audience that he was still a 'dark' guy and wasn't going to go around painting his nails and being a wholesome, sunshiney guy like some people want him to be. I didn't really think of that being him denying his softer side completely and everything good he's done this year. But maybe you're right - maybe he really doesn't want his dinof audience to see that side of him at all and likes to keep a strict line between dinof and liveshows/other things. Even if that's the case, I don't blame him for having a line. Just like I don't blame anyone for not enjoying that type of content. I guess my only frustration comes from some people being only negative and not liking him for who he is, while still claiming to be fans at the end of the day. I mean, people can do what they want. I'm just going on a pointless tangent now.
- flarequake
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I liked the video, though the length that was great at the time is what'll make it harder to rewatch. I've been watching a lot less YouTube except for Deps, though, so maybe I can start having it on in the background more. It also made it way less snappy especially with the spons and other video clips. The spons don't help the flow of any video really. The fanvid he screamed about was annoying, if he was that bothered he could show a lot less of it or not bring it to our attention at all
alittledizzy's last point was my main takeaway from this too. I love him for being wholesome and sweet in those encouraging end-of-liveshow moments, and other times (like every other time), and I don't enjoy wondering if he'd think me a fool believing him in the pastel edits video saying he does indeed have a wholesome side.
That said I did find most of the video really funny and was surprised by how many memes there were and that they were all last year, some seemed older.
I'm amused Dream Daddy is still being asked for. If they don't want to do it, they'd better not, but I loved their take on it, the characters, voices and everything. At least we'll always have Undertale and Phil as Papyrus.
alittledizzy's last point was my main takeaway from this too. I love him for being wholesome and sweet in those encouraging end-of-liveshow moments, and other times (like every other time), and I don't enjoy wondering if he'd think me a fool believing him in the pastel edits video saying he does indeed have a wholesome side.
That said I did find most of the video really funny and was surprised by how many memes there were and that they were all last year, some seemed older.
I'm amused Dream Daddy is still being asked for. If they don't want to do it, they'd better not, but I loved their take on it, the characters, voices and everything. At least we'll always have Undertale and Phil as Papyrus.
I won't be original either and I'll just say - I agree.alittledizzy wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 1:57 am(Even as I hit submit on this post I realize there is literally no original thought contained within, but what are forums for if not sharing the same opinion once a month.)
So I do agree with this, but I do want to specify that in my mind there's a difference between Dan being genuinely self-deprecating and negative and in Dan reacting with an exaggerated tone of self-deprecation or negativity to something that was a setup he himself put in place (which is the part of his video that made me eyeroll).
Also, it doesn't enamor me to him when he acts as though people reacting to the 'softer side of Sears' are fabricating something that isn't really there. He can preach about how he really is that dark depressing guy, and I believe that, because people are nuanced and he can be many things - but he's acting like we don't all remember how he spent half the year talking to his liveshow audience in soft voices telling us it'll all be okay and taking us through breathing exercises in his liveshows and reminding us we're all valid and important no matter how we are. That's the specific disconnect between main channel Dan and everywhere-else-Dan that doesn't gel with me. And I understand he does it because liveshows are a niche audience and his main channel is not, but still. It draws from my enjoyment. /kanyeshrug
I like Dan, I like Phil, I have no favorites. I don't believe I like a made-up version of Dan that only lives in my head, because I do take note of all the things that he shows us, things that add up to his personality. However, it's okay to like someone and still notice when they are exaggerating certain things, which I believe he did in his latest video.
I think these two sides fit together, in that sometimes people who struggle with things like depression and low self esteem can be extremely encouraging to other people because knowing how much it sucks to hate yourself and battle those demons makes you not want anyone else to feel that way.alittledizzy wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 1:57 am He can preach about how he really is that dark depressing guy, and I believe that, because people are nuanced and he can be many things - but he's acting like we don't all remember how he spent half the year talking to his liveshow audience in soft voices telling us it'll all be okay and taking us through breathing exercises in his liveshows and reminding us we're all valid and important no matter how we are. That's the specific disconnect between main channel Dan and everywhere-else-Dan that doesn't gel with me. And I understand he does it because liveshows are a niche audience and his main channel is not, but still. It draws from my enjoyment. /kanyeshrug
He's done pseudo inspirational messages on dinof in the past too, and joked about it not being a dinof video without it, so I don't think that's excluded in his statement either. But we know Dan focuses on negatives.
Phil himself has said that Dan has a sarcastic remark for everything, so that may truly be his default mode. Gaming channel Dan is certainly split between dragging Phil and praising him for minor victories, not sure which one has the majority.
(Also I hate typing on an ipad how do people manage on their phones? I must be old.)
That's my socializing quota for the month up.
I don't have much to say, except that I really really agree with the bolded part. That is all.apathy wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 12:38 pm I think these two sides fit together, in that sometimes people who struggle with things like depression and low self esteem can be extremely encouraging to other people because knowing how much it sucks to hate yourself and battle those demons makes you not want anyone else to feel that way.
He's done pseudo inspirational messages on dinof in the past too, and joked about it not being a dinof video without it, so I don't think that's excluded in his statement either. But we know Dan focuses on negatives.
Phil himself has said that Dan has a sarcastic remark for everything, so that may truly be his default mode. Gaming channel Dan is certainly split between dragging Phil and praising him for minor victories, not sure which one has the majority.
(Also I hate typing on an ipad how do people manage on their phones? I must be old.)
- LtrllySusan
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I've never been less excited about the gaming channel than after reading the replies to both the tweet and the YouTube post. More flash games and apps coming up, I guess. The majority of (good) games are just not made to be only played for 10 minutes.
Also, what is up with Doki Doki Literature Club? Is it the new FNAF in terms of... intense fandom? I had a quick look at the plot on wikipedia and I have no idea how people would think that they'd play that on the gaming channel.
Also, what is up with Doki Doki Literature Club? Is it the new FNAF in terms of... intense fandom? I had a quick look at the plot on wikipedia and I have no idea how people would think that they'd play that on the gaming channel.
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Yeah - I mean, I wouldn't say FNAF in terms of plot or quality since DDLC is pretty amazing, but in terms of sudden popularity it's along those lines. It's very, very unsuited to the gaming channel though. Even if the subject matter was such that they would show it in a video (it's not) there's literally no action in it, you don't even get to make a ton of choices. It's very subtle gameplay that is more about having a story told to you than anything else.LtrllySusan wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 3:32 pmAlso, what is up with Doki Doki Literature Club? Is it the new FNAF in terms of... intense fandom? I had a quick look at the plot on wikipedia and I have no idea how people would think that they'd play that on the gaming channel.
I'm... okay with the flash games and stuff coming up, though. I truly do not want them to start anything longer just before they go on tour, it would be year-of-Undertale all over again. Short and sweet but fun is okay with me, and maybe sequels to a few other videos that are fun for them to play once in a while if they don't drive into the ground.
I'd love to see them do more cooperative puzzle games. I am still mad they skipped so much on the bomb game that they tanked and decided not to play again. If they'd just taken it level by level and building skill then it would have continued to be great.