Dan & Phil Part 84: Still Alive

[Stakhanov]

Yea I just hope we get any sort of update and am optimistic because it's been a long time indeed since AP had a Q&A (did it ever have a Q&A?). The Q&A they did on tumblr also turned out to be informative, though limited to the tour. Wait and see. I would be disappointed if the only reason we get a Q&A is because Phil really has run out of ideas for AP vids and is just going to answer only the cliché questions. That would just be outsourcing the 'creative process' to the fans. But my expectation is we'll at least get some kind of vague statement about what we can expect (about DAPG). I'd consider 4 months and 'intermediate' amount of time for a hiatus. Now would also be a good time to pitch some kind of new project or collaboration that would be starting in the second half of the year. Perhaps the plan all along was for Dan to take a half-year sabbatical of some sort.

How you perceive 2018 is i think related to what kind of content you prefer. If you really liked Dan's solo content, It's hard to call 2018 a great year for content really. He struggled in the start of the year, did just a couple of shows and the Living my truth video was hopeful but ended up standing all by itself. The mukbang video already clarified that new content would be 'whenever' and I wonder why not more people picked up on the fact that if Dan was feeling so lackluster about creating content for his own channel, chances were this would also start impacting the content he makes with Phil... To me, that's a very logical thing. Why would he compartmentalize the different channels so much? It's basically all the same thing in the sense that you're professionally creating video's. If you're mentally in a bad spot and or feel burnt out that's usually going to impact all of your (professional) activities. That's what I would think at least.
I also found it very noticeable in the joint liveshows they did when they were back in London that Dan was completely not in it. Those live shows by themselves I found horrible, they were mostly spon on that cursed Ryze app (still glad I didn't install it) coupled with some practical info about the tour. After Phil got hospitalized my first thought was exhaustion since I've seen that happen to other people in my friends circle too. That said I have no idea of the actual medical situation Phil was/is in and he doesn't seem to want to go into to much detail. That was another indication to me that there would likely be some changes. As I remember someone saying on this forum: the tour was maybe their last big "hurray" and they might see it as the end of an era.

[madzilla84]

Yeah, I see where you’re coming from, but while I don’t think they’ll tour again (never say never, but I’m sure I remember them saying a few times that it was most likely the last one), they were quite insistent at the end of last year that there was no big Dan-and-Phil-Ending happening beyond the DAPG hiatus and pinof ending. Of course they’re entitled to change their minds, but if they have then we haven’t heard about it, which is why I’m hoping to hear something soon either way. I agree that it’s probably to do with Dan’s hiatus, though; makes sense that it would extend to all vids wherever they are.

[Apple In My Pie]

Thank you for the warm welcome am sure I’ll fit in wonderfully.

I really don’t expect anything big from the Q&A if I’m honest. A lot of people on twitter are hyping it up to be some holy grail of content but I really can’t see it. Don’t get me wrong I would love for phil to be more open (as in addressing the hiatus, not ‘lol how many hairs are up your nose’) but I can’t see that happening, in fact I don’t really think he’ll bring Dan up very often during it and it’s just going to be something quick and fluffy. IME D&P have never been the type to be transparent about these things — like when PINOF ended and people were like ‘...is that it?’ and dan made the comment of, ‘we thought you guys would’ve guessed’ - they don’t tend to state outright, they just go with it. Then again, I could be completely wrong.

I am surprised Phil wanted to do a Q&A in the first place tbh. I always got the impression that they were both tired of the “wacky questions!!1!111” format of PINOF and yet they don’t like being very open about their lives. It does make me wonder if he’s doing a bit of barrel-scraping.

(Although, honestly, if Phil is happy to do solo content I wish he’d go solo on DAPG too. I loved watching him play Shelter!)

[thestigdrivesamini]

If he is interested in opening up and being more ‘Phil Lester’ than AP, something that I think would be really interesting as well as beneficial to others is his side of Daniel and Depression. I was talking with a friend about this and it’s a way to have a deeper topic, while still keeping the things he wants private.

Even from a friend/roommate perspective, I’m sure he’d be a wealth of knowledge. He’s not only witnessed Dan’s struggle with mental illness, but has been one of his biggest support system (according to Dan himself). I’d love to hear his views on Dan leaving his phone at home while he was out, or how he made sure Dan was eating/drinking enough.

Especially considering their career was largely based on them being a duo (radio show/dapg/pinof), it must have been incredible hard on Phil as well.

I just think it would be interesting to see his thoughts on how to be supportive, but not overbearing and where his lines were to push/ get him professional help. It would be so beneficial for others to see a partners side of things.

[Ablissa]

Welcome @Apple In My Pie! Nice that you're joining the bants right away!

I also would love it if Phil did some solo gaming videos, but sadly, I don't think it'll happen. I've been thinking about this and I feel like there isn't a lot that Phil can do right now without angering the (already upset) phandom.
Collab with someone else? I can only imagine the fandom meltdown. Solo gaming? A flood of 'ARE YOU NOT FRIENDS WITH DAN ANYMORE???'. A proper Q&A? Well, but how does he respond to questions about Dan...?

I sincerely hope he doesn't make the Q&A just randomness and gives us some kind of an update on what they're planning this year, but I'm not holding my breath. I think that for the most part, until Dan comes back, all we'll get from Phil are these safe, on brand videos, because he likely just doesn't want to risk it.

(He gets criticised for his safe videos too, but that's another story)

@thestigdrivesamini I would love that! Again I don't think it's going to happen... at least not when Dan is still 'gone', maybe not ever. I guess we'll see how open they are once they make a return to joint content.
But he could talk about his own anxiety, that would be nice.

[autumnhearth]

I’m just clinging onto what Dan said at the end of their last liveshow that “it’s all in the service of doing even better things for you”. Just did a quick scroll to find that and really the only thing they promised were AP videos and that we would still see them “on the Internet”.

I think they are definitely over the whacky questions and we’ve watched Phil grow tired of solo liveshows, but Phil has been known for his viewer connection since early on and he’s got to have membership incentives beyond little cacti avatars. We can make our judgements after he’s posted. Personally I would like to see him answer a round of quickfire questions followed by longer more thoughtful ones.

[noodlebum]

(Although, honestly, if Phil is happy to do solo content I wish he’d go solo on DAPG too. I loved watching him play Shelter!)

Yep that's what I was thinking too!

[liola]

Honestly, we reached the point where both Dan and Phil can't do anything without losing.

Phil has never promised a different kind of content really, and to be honest the fact that he always kept some kind of wall between himself and the audience made him the most appealing to me. I drank every single information he let out, I enjoyed his liveshows because of the things he would tell us and more generally the calming positive vibes I always got out of him. It's not even true that he wasn't as open, in my opinion. He might not say his opinions on things as Dan does/did, but in a lot of things he's been way more open, like his relationship with his family.

I don't have big expectations for the Q&A because he didn't promise anything. He'll get so many questions and he's going to reply to what he feels comfortable with, and while I hope he can say something about the future, if he doesn't maybe the "blame" isn't solely on him but also on the fact that Dan is still not showing himself online in a creator way. If they have any plans, I doubt he will want to talk about them unless Dan is also okay with it .- and if they involve Dan at all, it would be quite hard to talk about them without him. Personally, I'm doing for an AP solo project, I really hope we get something like it. From the glimpse we've had on his process for his own solo merch, he seems to enjoy working on creative things for his own brand and is very in control of it.

I don't know what to think about joint content, I'll be honest. I personally think DAPG is dead for good (but i would love if Phil did some solo gaming), and I selfishly don't want AP to become a joint channel again - I think Phil probably doesn't care but as a fan of him as a solo creator as well, I want him to get the time to explore his own channel by himself like he hasn't in a long time. On the other hand, dinof has never been the place for joint content except when they had to spon a collab project. So if joint content comes back, they might have to find a place for it - if it comes back on a regular basis like with dapg, and if not I just hope we get to the point where it goes on both channels because as a viewer it always irked me that Dan seemed to just not want joint content on his channel (I know it's not that deep, i'm just saying it as a viewer pov)

All in all, we're still stuck on the "let's wait and see" which is basically the mood for this year in fandom so far

[sapienveneficus]

I've been keeping my expectations low as well, sub basement level low. That way, if he only answers questions about cereal and plants, I wont be disappointed, and if he chooses to answer a real question or two, I'll be blown away.

I'm a little disappointed that Dan's returned to radio silence mode. I hate to be this cynical, but was the only reason he posted pictures at the beginning of the month to drum up interest in their merch sale? The timing was a bit suspicious.

[dellamay]

I'm new here, but I've been following this discussion with interest. Maybe I'm just naive (as a relatively new member of the phandom), or but doesn't it seem like D&P gave us plenty of clues to go on in their December communications? The message I got was that yes, they are a real couple. They were as unsubtle as can be without stating it overtly. I thought Phil's "I thought it was obvious" in the Christmas liveshow (about the end of Pinof) was a tipoff. Dab and Evan's engagement in the last gaming video was another. The things they were saying ("They are so strong together", etc.) weren't really applicable to Dab and Evan, but rather to Dan and Phil. And then the Pinof bloopers released on Christmas Day were so open, for me they erased any doubt.

It seems to me the "creative think" they wanted to have was about how to go forward with joint content when the mystery (are they or aren't they) is gone. Would innuendos and flirtations between two men in a long-term relationship still have the same electricity for viewers, or was the electricity bound up in the uncertainty? More openness complicates the dynamic they've developed for DAPG -- so they'll have to find a new way to relate onscreen.

I thought all the Christmastime communications were building to something -- and maybe they were, but Dan is taking a long time to get it out. It sharpens my empathy for what they must both be going through this year when I imagine what kind of toll it would take on a couple to spend a year in tour buses and hotel rooms. I'm trying not to catastrophize about the state of future D&P content, but instead to imagine they are busy "being happy." I can't imagine Phil's going to lower the veil on their privacy in his Q&A if Dan's not ready yet.

[Ablissa]

The sale has been extended. They restocked the tote bag, but the plushies are gone.

I think they also added the Dil and Tabitha shirts? I think they weren't on sale before. This kind of further confirms for me that the era of Dil is over, but hopefully Dab will continue when/if they return to the gaming channel. (Which, remember - they ended at the engagement, not the wedding. Their fans will pester them FOREVER.)

[alittledizzy]

I decided to try and head off some of the panic about the shop closing by just directly asking, and they actually responded - no need for anyone to stress, danandphilshop isn't going anywhere. (Under a cut because it's massive and I don't have time to figure out how to resize it, oops.)

[glitterintheair]

The sale has been extended. They restocked the tote bag, but the plushies are gone.

I think they also added the Dil and Tabitha shirts? I think they weren't on sale before. This kind of further confirms for me that the era of Dil is over, but hopefully Dab will continue when/if they return to the gaming channel. (Which, remember - they ended at the engagement, not the wedding. Their fans will pester them FOREVER.)

The Dil and Tab shirts were on sale already, at least since Tuesday which is when I checked the shop.
I want Devan merch. Just give me Devan plushies, already. Also yeah I will be so pissed if we don't get the wedding episode, are you kidding me?

Thanks @alittledizzy for asking them about it!

[Stakhanov]

@thestigdrivesamini Very much agree that a Phil's side on "Daniel and Depression", or just his experience of living together, or other issues he might has dealt with himself would make for an amazing video that truly would be a change for AP and peek my interest. I think Phil is an amazing guy. Caring, funny, loyal. It's just that after all these years the wall around that part of his personality is still as impenetrable as it ever has been. I need to go back to like 2010 and earlier Phil to lose some of that filter.

I'm new here, but I've been following this discussion with interest. Maybe I'm just naive (as a relatively new member of the phandom), or but doesn't it seem like D&P gave us plenty of clues to go on in their December communications? The message I got was that yes, they are a real couple. They were as unsubtle as can be without stating it overtly. I thought Phil's "I thought it was obvious" in the Christmas liveshow (about the end of Pinof) was a tipoff. Dab and Evan's engagement in the last gaming video was another. The things they were saying ("They are so strong together", etc.) weren't really applicable to Dab and Evan, but rather to Dan and Phil. And then the Pinof bloopers released on Christmas Day were so open, for me they erased any doubt.

It seems to me the "creative think" they wanted to have was about how to go forward with joint content when the mystery (are they or aren't they) is gone. Would innuendos and flirtations between two men in a long-term relationship still have the same electricity for viewers, or was the electricity bound up in the uncertainty? More openness complicates the dynamic they've developed for DAPG -- so they'll have to find a new way to relate onscreen.

I thought all the Christmastime communications were building to something -- and maybe they were, but Dan is taking a long time to get it out. It sharpens my empathy for what they must both be going through this year when I imagine what kind of toll it would take on a couple to spend a year in tour buses and hotel rooms. I'm trying not to catastrophize about the state of future D&P content, but instead to imagine they are busy "being happy." I can't imagine Phil's going to lower the veil on their privacy in his Q&A if Dan's not ready yet.

Hi and welcome! There's a lot to unpack in your post. If I understand you correctly, you interpret some of the events of Dilmas as D&P trying to (un)subtly communicate about themselves? I would agree Dilmas was building up to something but I don't think it's a hidden parable about themselves. It was leading up to the end of the series, which in itself fitted nicely into the broader message that they were going to take a break.

The "creative think" imo relates more to the fact that they are reconsidering their commitment to their own style of content and youtube and general. About if and how they wanted to still make joint content together, as well as Dan's ongoing hiatus. Phil followed up with a video that he wanted to change up some things, which enforced my view that they a primarily just searching for the identity of their channels.
While I think your question - what if the mystery is gone?- is an interesting one, you need to read and assume a lot into Dilmas and their announcements to arrive at the conclusion that they are pondering coming out as a couple and the changes that would bring to how they relate onscreen. I also think you start from a strong bias towards phan being real (as almost all of the regular posters on this forum believe). To me there isn't so much mystery left in their relationship. They have said multiple times and very loudly that they aren't a couple. The question is whether you believe that or not. If you don't, I can understand how you see an element of mystery as I presume you'd want them to be consistent and what they say and the reality of them being a couple. Which remains at odds. But if you think they're close friends, there's no need for them to change position.
It would of course hit a good part of the community like lightening if they insisted on "setting the record straight again". Considering there's little upside for them in upsetting the beliefs of the community who think they are together, I really only see them speaking out on "Phan" again when their hand is forced - e.g. when they would start a relationship with someone else and moved to seperate places, or if they wanted to take totally different paths professionally and wouldn't think it likely anymore to collab on youtube. But even in that scenario, I think it's more likely they would go the pinof way and wait for people to draw their own conclusions.

I agree that Phil is unlikely to lower the veil of privacy much. Rightly so because whether it's about the nature of their relationship or their own struggle with (the struggle for) mental health (of others), it's deeply private and not something I think Phil wants to share with us, regardless of where Dan is on the issue.

[knq]

I've been keeping my expectations low as well, sub basement level low. That way, if he only answers questions about cereal and plants, I wont be disappointed, and if he chooses to answer a real question or two, I'll be blown away.

I'm a little disappointed that Dan's returned to radio silence mode. I hate to be this cynical, but was the only reason he posted pictures at the beginning of the month to drum up interest in their merch sale? The timing was a bit suspicious.

I don't necessarily think that's cynical. IRL is (1/3) his company and if sharing a photo/reminding the internet he's alive helps his company do better, that seems like the professional thing to do, even if he's not usually involved with marketing. In general it seems like Dan needs external pressure to get himself motivated, so I wouldn't be too surprised if his short return to the internet was inspired by the IRL sale.

@dellamay Welcome! Your icon is precious.

@alittledizzy You are an actual phandom angel.

[Apple In My Pie]

I am surprised that they’re getting rid of some of the items from the store though. TATINOF yes, some of the older branded stuff yes, as I can’t imagine many people will be buying that stuff now — but some of the newer stuff like the gradient phone case and the pink/purple hoodies — they were lumped in as tour merch when I saw Interactive Introverts so I’m surprised they’ve been reduced so soon especially when the original II merch hasn’t been reduced. Ditto the Dan and Phil Games merchandise, it still feels relatively new to me so I’m surprised it’s being reduced so soon. If anything, I wonder if they’d been planning for this hiatus (at least on the gaming channel) for a long time and knew interest in the gaming channel would dwindle, hence the (pretty random) push of DAPG merch and its subsequent reduce in price...

I don’t quite understand the pink and purple theme they had going on though, either. I do have a purple hoodie, when it was marked as an exclusive pop-up-shop item, and I love it. But I remember at the time thinking... ‘they’ve never pushed this theme before? It doesn’t feel very... ‘D&P’ to me?’

[Ablissa]

Loads of shops have spring sales. I wouldn't read too much into it other than them getting rid of some stuff, boosting sales (which surely dropped during the hiatus), and maybe coming up with new merch when they make a return.

(I agree that the pink and purple theme was pretty random for the hoodie, but they look super nice!!)

[autumnhearth]

The D&P stuff was originally supposed to be pop-up shop exclusive so it’s not that surprising it didn’t have a long life. My son wants a Dil shirt, bunny slippers and the free plushie so I’m glad they extended it even if I was quite indignant when the sale was first advertised.

[Stakhanov]

So, i'm guessing it's just a spring sale but have they ever done deep discounts like this? I don't really follow their merch much, but all i remember are sales and codes for like 10%-20% off?

[glitterintheair]

I don't know if they have done deep discounts before but I was thinking about how their joint shop is still the only one with recognizable merch. The AP and DH shops are lowkey, with things you could easily find in a store; you would never assume it's youtube merch.
However, the dap shop is still not that subtle, so I wonder if they want to get rid of their old stuff to come out with more lowkey merch (not that I am actually expecting it, by the way. 2019 taught me not to have hopes and dreams, but still.. it would be nice).

[flarequake]

At various times they've discounted the last things hugely eg the US Tatinof poster was £1 or £3 and another was the other price, I don't remember which was which, but I bought both at different times. There have been other things hugely discounted to clear, I've bought a few of them over the years, I think one of the wristbands might have gone as low as 50p and there was another small thing even less once, 30p maybe (postage and sales of other stuff cover it, I guess, and it's good to have stuff all go where it's wanted and not thrown away).

[Stakhanov]

Oh ok thanks so there are some bargains to be had if you're willing to wait out the hype.I want my "Rawr i'm a Danosaur" shirt

I'm wondering if they'll restock. There's nothing much going on that would .. require new merch. There II merch is basically dated, no doubt some fans will still buy it but I can't imagine the sales volumes being anything near to what they sold while touring.
Which makes me wonder (again) how Martyn thinks about the hiatus. The decreasing popularity and general lack of new projects must weigh heavily on the IRL limited business. Sure, they've got some other youtubers but D&P is most of their business. What about all the girls from the shop? Do they only work with temp contracts?

[autumnhearth]

IRL Merch’s latest Instastory says “one more weekend to snap up these never-to-be-stocked goodies”. So no.

I need help from any current or former Mancunians (what a strange demonym). I was trying to work out all the places Dan and Phil went on October 19th 2009 on a map (after discovering a possible dinner location, more on that later) and it seems that their Starbucks on St Ann’s Square (that was the location right? It’s the architecture that matches) actually closed in June of 2017 and a new storefront opened in September 2017... however a search of google maps shows no Starbucks in that area... but like they went by there In GTPWTW (though they made it seem like it was in Piccadilly Gardens, which used to have a corner Starbucks but it was all black, not stone and anyway it’s in the center of a strip now) ... were they trying to spare us the heartache? What’s the truth?

@sparkle I’m summoning you!

[gnostic]

Hi guys, a bit offtopic but since the discussion is on the merch

anyone here own amazingphilshop hoodie, what material is it made from?

[autumnhearth]

Nevermind I overlooked an architectural detail. Their’s was the one on Exchange Square at City Centre. All is well.