Dan & Phil Part 100: full-time internet homowners

[alittledizzy]

I just answered my own question, the view count is hidden because it's a yt original!

Here's the embed for anyone that missed it:

[Levitating]

This was SO SO GOOD! I cannot believe how this how was cathartic and well-thought and helpful.

The most interesting thing I think is that it is not just about Pride as a queer person (although he emphasises it as such), it is Pride about who you are regardless of everything else you identify with, regardless of "where" you should apply your pride to.

It's awesome! I am going to share this with everyone.

[inanerat]

I really,, liked that. I always crave more from things like this but I have to remind myself there's only an hour when what I really want to do is watch Dan sit down and discuss this stuff and all of his complicated thoughts about it for days on end. For being a piece not entirely in Dan's control and I'm sure with quite a few restraints/points to hit I think it was smooth.

I'll probably have more thoughts later but right now I just want to give Dan a big hug and like, hold onto him.

Also Phil is a terrible actor and that is NOT a criticism. I love him so much with my whole ass heart.

[Phantasy]

Still only half way through… but wanted to remark on his opening comments about 2021 and living his hot boy summer fantasy (and catching aspirational STDs)—same like with BIG, he has these throw away comments/jokes about sex that all but dismiss Phil. Is is just sacrificing reality of the sake of a joke? Is he really in a open relationship? lol

I admit, it’s such a silly thing to get hung up on, but a casual viewer would hear that and think, oh this dudes single—is that the perception he want to put out there?

Also, dismissing away Phil as the temptation and complacency part of his brain I think hits on a deeper theme that I wonder if Dan really does see Phil as in a way holding him back in some weird way. This is the same sentiment from “College Dropout” — one road is college and lawyer aspirations and the other is fun time Phil, playing video games and being creative. Makes me wonder if subconsciously at least Dan sees Phil as the safe and comfortable route and maybe in small part resents that?

Probably silly things to overthink, but there it is anyhow. Now back to the rest of the vid (where I’ll probably end up eating my words).

[alittledizzy]

Still only half way through… but wanted to remark on his opening comments about 2021 and living his hot boy summer fantasy (and catching aspirational STDs)—same like with BIG, he has these throw away comments/jokes about sex that all but dismiss Phil. Is is just sacrificing reality of the sake of a joke? Is he really in a open relationship? lol

I admit, it’s such a silly thing to get hung up on, but a casual viewer would hear that and think, oh this dudes single—is that the perception he want to put out there?

Also, dismissing away Phil as the temptation and complacency part of his brain I think hits on a deeper theme that I wonder if Dan really does see Phil as in a way holding him back in some weird way. This is the same sentiment from “College Dropout” — one road is college and lawyer aspirations and the other is fun time Phil, playing video games and being creative. Makes me wonder if subconsciously at least Dan sees Phil as the safe and comfortable route and maybe in small part resents that?

Probably silly things to overthink, but there it is anyhow. Now back to the rest of the vid (where I’ll probably end up eating my words).

For me, it really is that those are the easy jokes Dan wants to make.

He's always sacrificed reality for the sake of a punchline. Literally, always. We saw it in videos with minor things and with bigger ones. He'd talk about buying a costume on a liveshow but in the video pretend like he'd never seen it. He pretended he'd never played Bubble Bobble before when we know he and Phil played it together years before. Dan has in Dan's mind what makes for a good joke, for a good moment in a video, and he scripts reality around it to make the punchline work.

But the actual reality for me is in the things Dan doesn't say. We get one line jokes about sex but he doesn't mention needing a relationship. He doesn't mention regretting any romantic relationships he lost out on. He doesn't talk about people he could have been with but didn't with any specifics at all. So yeah... this is just Dan being Dan, to me, and when put in context with the pattern of Dan's humor over the years I don't see any reason to read into that specifically.

[alittledizzy]

[tinnie]

Still only half way through… but wanted to remark on his opening comments about 2021 and living his hot boy summer fantasy (and catching aspirational STDs)—same like with BIG, he has these throw away comments/jokes about sex that all but dismiss Phil. Is is just sacrificing reality of the sake of a joke? Is he really in a open relationship? lol

I admit, it’s such a silly thing to get hung up on, but a casual viewer would hear that and think, oh this dudes single—is that the perception he want to put out there?

This is something I've been thinking about as well, especially after this video. Because he spends an hour talking about all the things he missed out on because of not being out, not living as his true self etc. And I fully understand him not wanting to be open about what he and Phil are to each other after all the drama the fandom has created for them and the associated trauma. But then there is a disconnect between Dan making these jokes and the moments we see with him and Phil being married™. And it makes me wonder whether there is a middle ground between him being authentic and honest about these things and not revealing enough for the sake of privacy and whether that's something he'll ever work up to. Or whether we're interpreting thigns wrong

[alittledizzy]

[BlueSnoko]

He just spoke with contrapoints about how shagging around won't make him feel better

That's NOT Contrapoints! That's Abigail Thorn, of Philosophy tube. I recommend the channel. Wit, deep intelligence and earnest compassion all wrapped up in a firecracker of a theater kid.

[Tornbetweenfandoms]

He just spoke with contrapoints about how shagging around won't make him feel better

That's NOT Contrapoints! That's Abigail Thorn, of Philosophy tube. I recommend the channel. Wit, deep intelligence and earnest compassion all wrapped up in a firecracker of a theater kid.

Thank you for the correction! I get the two channels mixed up constantly despite having watched both both way more intelligent humans than me!

[Levitating]

Still only half way through… but wanted to remark on his opening comments about 2021 and living his hot boy summer fantasy (and catching aspirational STDs)—same like with BIG, he has these throw away comments/jokes about sex that all but dismiss Phil. Is is just sacrificing reality of the sake of a joke? Is he really in a open relationship? lol

I admit, it’s such a silly thing to get hung up on, but a casual viewer would hear that and think, oh this dudes single—is that the perception he want to put out there?

Also, dismissing away Phil as the temptation and complacency part of his brain I think hits on a deeper theme that I wonder if Dan really does see Phil as in a way holding him back in some weird way. This is the same sentiment from “College Dropout” — one road is college and lawyer aspirations and the other is fun time Phil, playing video games and being creative. Makes me wonder if subconsciously at least Dan sees Phil as the safe and comfortable route and maybe in small part resents that?

Probably silly things to overthink, but there it is anyhow. Now back to the rest of the vid (where I’ll probably end up eating my words).

Same!

Because yes he "pretends" not to have bought one thing for the sake of the video etc, but those are "obvious" pretend-games. The thing about sex is different.

You know, to me Depression and later coming out video were surprising. He had always joked about the so many things he mentioned in the video (laying down on the floor etc) but to me they were jokes. He was joking about being that awkward/that depressed/that "blob" etc. Then the video showed and revealed that actually his jokes were made to be funny and they are a way he copes with these things BUT they were also telling the truth.

I had never wanted to assumed anything because I felt so uncomfortable w the 'demon phannies' I saw on tumblr, always speculating about him. I listen to him "these are jokes people!" (about v-video etc) and I believed him. Why should I not? It felt like dismissing his value as a human being to think that there was something behind it if he said "these are jokes".

Then the BIG video told me that you people were right; that he was gay, that his depression jokes were true. I was a bit shocked.

So now when he jokes I cannot longer not see that he may actually be telling the truth and this is his way to deal with these things. The "pretending" he does in his video are another thing - too obvious.

[alittledizzy]

Still only half way through… but wanted to remark on his opening comments about 2021 and living his hot boy summer fantasy (and catching aspirational STDs)—same like with BIG, he has these throw away comments/jokes about sex that all but dismiss Phil. Is is just sacrificing reality of the sake of a joke? Is he really in a open relationship? lol

I admit, it’s such a silly thing to get hung up on, but a casual viewer would hear that and think, oh this dudes single—is that the perception he want to put out there?

Also, dismissing away Phil as the temptation and complacency part of his brain I think hits on a deeper theme that I wonder if Dan really does see Phil as in a way holding him back in some weird way. This is the same sentiment from “College Dropout” — one road is college and lawyer aspirations and the other is fun time Phil, playing video games and being creative. Makes me wonder if subconsciously at least Dan sees Phil as the safe and comfortable route and maybe in small part resents that?

Probably silly things to overthink, but there it is anyhow. Now back to the rest of the vid (where I’ll probably end up eating my words).

Same!

Because yes he "pretends" not to have bought one thing for the sake of the video etc, but those are "obvious" pretend-games. The thing about sex is different.

You know, to me Depression and later coming out video were surprising. He had always joked about the so many things he mentioned in the video (laying down on the floor etc) but to me they were jokes. He was joking about being that awkward/that depressed/that "blob" etc. Then the video showed and revealed that actually his jokes were made to be funny and they are a way he copes with these things BUT they were also telling the truth.

I had never wanted to assumed anything because I felt so uncomfortable w the 'demon phannies' I saw on tumblr, always speculating about him. I listen to him "these are jokes people!" (about v-video etc) and I believed him. Why should I not? It felt like dismissing his value as a human being to think that there was something behind it if he said "these are jokes".

Then the BIG video told me that you people were right; that he was gay, that his depression jokes were true. I was a bit shocked.

So now when he jokes I cannot longer not see that he may actually be telling the truth and this is his way to deal with these things. The "pretending" he does in his video are another thing - too obvious.

The thing about sex is not different to me. I picked those examples because they're ones people would remember, but Dan has always had this pattern to the extent that Dan and Phil lying to us about things we already know basically became a fandom meme. It is a valid point that Dan jokes about things that are true. But in the case of depression and his sexuality, those were things he joked about while trying to come to terms with. His sex life is not something I see him working out in a public arena before privately. That is the antithesis of everything Dan has told us about how he regards things important to him and his privacy. I think for Dan what he enjoys right now is being able to make the jokes - he's out! He can say things that reference kissing guys and he wants to do that, he wants that to be integrated into his humor. And his options are either make the jokes about Phil (which crosses boundaries he doesn't want to cross with the public/private life) or make them about random non-existent potential people.

Maybe I'm wrong and Dan is really out here telling six million people he wants to get laid while also moving into a house with Phil. But it just seems strange to me to put so much more emphasis on the jokes he makes in videos than on the choices he makes in his actual life.

[howadorableright]

There was a point in the corridor, after his emo phase when he went to go find Phil to go home, when he said to Phil "can I ask you a question..
? " And he paused for maybe ten seconds max before asking him an inane question about ten years ago
But my absolute CLOWN brain went from zero to a hundred at that time that he was about to ask him to marry him. like " this would be such a perfect dramatic ending...he just spoke with contrapoints about how shagging around won't make him feel better he needs to fund his purpose...he's just been reminded about emo Dan and what helped him through that time........." Lmao
I am still recovering from that completely self inflicted adrenaline rush

OMG I'm so glad I'm not the only one who had that thought

oh god i didn't even think about that and now i will never stop thinking about that aw cant help but feel a lil guilty for wanting that when ik the video had nothing to do w that but try as i might that part of myself will never leave

[BlueSnoko]

Also, dismissing away Phil as the temptation and complacency part of his brain I think hits on a deeper theme that I wonder if Dan really does see Phil as in a way holding him back in some weird way.

I didn't see it that way. I saw it as Phil being his safe space, his shelter in storm.  The thing about surviving trauma is that safe spaces save your life.  They give you the ability to be yourself without judgmemt when that's impossible in the greater world. It's critical. Phil create a tiny little absurd world philled with love and acceptance where Dan could just be, without even knowing what being Dan was. Dan has said on more than one occasion that this acceptance saved his life.
 
But to fully heal from trauma, you need to step outside of those spaces in order to confront what hurt you.  Not abandon them. Just stand on your own in the unsafe world and figure out how to make it less scary.

Dan telling off Phil in his mind palace is not Dan inwardly addressing Phil. It's Dan addressing the part of himself that wants not to think about the things that cause him pain, to stay mentally only in the safe space of Phil and games and banter - but he knows he has to let go of the security blanket and face them. Which good because your partner being your security blanket/entire safe world sounds a little codependent for the long term.   And after you're done with the hard stuff, you can stomp around shouting for said partner to decompress with over Mario Kart in your safe world.

[howadorableright]

There was a point in the corridor, after his emo phase when he went to go find Phil to go home, when he said to Phil "can I ask you a question..
? " And he paused for maybe ten seconds max before asking him an inane question about ten years ago
But my absolute CLOWN brain went from zero to a hundred at that time that he was about to ask him to marry him. like " this would be such a perfect dramatic ending...he just spoke with contrapoints about how shagging around won't make him feel better he needs to fund his purpose...he's just been reminded about emo Dan and what helped him through that time........." Lmao
I am still recovering from that completely self inflicted adrenaline rush

OMG I'm so glad I'm not the only one who had that thought

oh god i didn't even think about that and now i will never stop thinking about that aw cant help but feel a lil guilty for wanting that when ik the video had nothing to do w that but try as i might that part of myself will never leave

adding onto myself bc i forgot to ask - did anyone else notice phil's acting being better? i feel like he was so natural but maybe it's also because i know nothing about acting

[BlueSnoko]

There was a point in the corridor, after his emo phase when he went to go find Phil to go home, when he said to Phil "can I ask you a question..
? " And he paused for maybe ten seconds max before asking him an inane question about ten years ago
But my absolute CLOWN brain went from zero to a hundred at that time that he was about to ask him to marry him. like " this would be such a perfect dramatic ending... Lmao
I am still recovering from that completely self inflicted adrenaline rush

I had that exact same moment because they had so clearly expressed not wanting to go public but the narrative suddenly seemed to point towards openly gay husbands. It didn't seem like them, but they have certainly suprised us in the past. I definitely had an adrenaline rush of my own, and I was lowkey relieved when bit didn't happen.

And having come down from the initial high some hours later I'm suddenly wondering if Dan was deliberately playing with fandom expectations - after all, 2022 is but a year away, and D&P do love to troll.

[snoopysadie]

BlueSnoko's post about phil being dan's safe space... *chef's kiss* everything I wanted to say, but better.

I am so overwhelmed. I got to see 40 minutes, had my class, and then finished it.

What stuck with me the most was when dan was beating himself up saying "all the people i could've helped". first, so dan of him to feel guilty that his coming out didn't happen sooner so it helped less people... also untrue. i already wrote a comment on the video but i find it beautiful that, even when dan was homophobic of himself, he was still accepting of others. i don't remember if 2011/2012 dan was this beacon of hope for the queer outcasts yet, but, before the years where it was obvious they were in glass closets, let's say before the monster pops vid, they were still super accepting guys. and i just... ugh i love them so much. i love that even though dan couldn't be there for himself like that, he was for the rest of us. and i hate he felt guilty he couldn't help more. i hope phil gave him a hug.

now, the second moment with phil really had me. dan seemingly ending his journey by calling out for phil as he was trying to find his way back home...

and i hope i can embed this well because this comment was EVERYTHING:

phil literally appearing for the snacks and just chilling, as fish IN the water

[lefthandedism]

I said something similar after BIG and I'll say it again: I think Dan really does want to make out with a hot boy in the crush of a club after pride. And I think he will do just that if the opportunity arises. And I think it would have no effect on his relationship with Phil, except maybe give them something (else) to talk about.

My favorite part was Dan's conversation with Tyler. I think they could be such good (gay) friends, and maybe they will be. It's just too bad Dan wasn't comfortable having that friendship five years ago.

[Levitating]

I had written something and I thought I published it but I must have cancelled it!
The only thing I am willing to repeat myself for is: @bluesnoko your words are beautiful and profound


As for the rest of the video: is there some significance in that "you're a woman" Dan says while talking to his fairy godmother/sub-conscious?

[inanerat]

Blue, thank you for articulating that so well.

When it comes to the sexual jokes, it doesn't really phase me much because I feel like it's such a Dan thing. Sexual humor and references are something that have been part of his comedy for a long time and I'm guessing it's a quite cathartic experience for him to let out all of the gay ones that he chose to push aside for many years. Also, as someone else mentioned, having them be directed at Phil would seem to cross the general boundary they have with that so making up a hypothetical situation with some other person makes sense. Also Dan, as he himself has said on occasion, tends to be up for a little sexual attention every so often, even if he has no intent on going through with any of it.

The comment on the head voice being a woman did perk my ears up as well (very predictable for me lmao). It felt like something that didn't necessarily need to be acknowledged, Abigail could've simply played that role and it would make sense because she is a friend of Dan's and fellow queer UK creator and fits the role well, but it was mentioned. I honestly thought from when that was brought up initially that it would lead to some discussion of feelings of femininity and how that played into Dan not being proud, being scared to express himself more freely, etc. but the conversation went in a different direction and that didn't seem to be the main point. Which leaves the odd feeling of not knowing if it was a side point or just a transition to the meat of the conversation.

It might just be me, but I've had the feeling for a while (ever since big really) that gender things are still something Dan is mulling over a lot. It's a big and complicated thing to sort out your personal relationship to, and since he spent so much time boxing away and not unpacking his sexuality it wouldn't surprise me if there's stuff in the gender box that he's still picking through and kicking around. Like things like depression and sexuality, that were themes and truths disguised in jokes I wouldn't be surprised if gender stuff is something we continue to see Dan kick around and process in his weird way where we get these confusing public glimpses and the reality is Dan himself doesn't really know or have the answers either for a while. And with that said, I give him 2-3 years for a video pulling apart gender and his relationship with it after some continued gender crisis. (kind of joking but also not really??)

(And I want to be clear in saying this, I'm not pushing anything on Dan and don't think anyone should. I'm seeing his patterns and noticing things and thinking about possibilities for the future, very much bias by similarities to my own (and others that I know) experiences. I think the best thing, really what people are already doing, is to provide the open space for exploration, however subtle, to happen and be greeted with acceptance and care)

[anna_begins]

Dan's joke about how he wanted to live his "hot boy summer 'gay and proud' fantasy by mingling and probably tingling from all the aspirational STDs he'd catch" is the style of joke that he does that is an exaggeration of the truth. Just like how he's previously said he's so tired of being cooped up because of covid that when it's over he wants to go the park and lick a lamp post and hug people's legs (or something like that lol). Based on what we know about Dan Howell, it seems highly unlikely that he's actually going to run around licking lamp posts, just like it seems highly unlikely that he's going to go around having unprotected sex in the hopes of catching lots of STDs. I think there's truth in wanting a hot boy summer, just like there's truth in him wanting to be a bit more social after covid restrictions, but it probably just means doing the stuff like he mentioned with Tyler, like going to a gay bar and singing Lady Gaga at the top of his lungs with other gay people and just having fun without having to worry about being outed.

Regarding what he wants people to perceive his relationship with Phil as, dnp know anyone that is invested in them is aware of what they mean to each other and I'm guessing at this point they view outsider's opinions on their relationship as irrelevant.

And as far as Dan wanting to be "authentic" yet keeping his personal life private, I think there's nothing more "authentic' to dnp than protecting their relationship and one of the current ways they do this is to not publicly discuss it (you'll have to go to Cornelia another ice cream shop if you want any scoops )

[Catallena]

I liked it and I'm very proud of Dan for the journey he has made in his life. And I thought the concept was excellent. The execution not so much though...

I gotta say, I expected more. I know I should've lowered my expectations, that's on me.

Not more production value or whatever, but something that went a little bit deeper. By the title, I thought that this would go into moments of his life and career, and looking at them from the perspective of a now Proud Dan imagining what could've been and talking about how certain situations and people affected him for better or for worse. At the end we'd arrive at the conclusion that in the end it doesn't matter. You can't turn back time. Dan is Dan, and all those experiences shaped him into the wonderful person he is.

We did get that conclusion. But the road it took to get there was very bumpy and confusing, and it left me feeling a little bit frustrated. It never really hit the spots that I wanted it to. Some things dragged on, others seemed rushed. It all resulted in a somewhat more shallow end product than I had anticipated. I think my issues lay mostly with the script and pacing? I might need to rewatch it, but don't count on that anytime soon. An hour of content takes A LOT out of me.

I honestly really liked the Phannie Q&A part, which surprised me because I'm someone who usually cringes all the way through these type of things. But everyone was comfortable on camera and seemed to be having a good time, props to everyone involved! It was very nice and wholesome to see Dan connect and interact with his audience again. I've missed that. Since his coming out there's been plenty of shit from other fandoms (and lots of ex phannies) about how Dan ~hates his audience because we traumatized him by writing phanfiction~ or whatever the bad take of the week is. I think this does prove that that isn't true. It nicely connected with what he has said before about meeting people who were out and proud, asking them to sign and take pictures with flags, while he himself was still closeted. Cool to see that brought back. Also there wasn't a robotic script so 10/10 good stuff all around

So then we go to a part that's kind of a reverse of that? Dan talks to singer Will Young, who left a big impression on baby Dan by coming out all those years ago. It was kinda funny how Will Young had this super calm energy over him while speaking, meanwhile Dan went jkcxfdgjkl;lkjhfdsetrytiop to the point where I could hardly follow him. Honestly though, this went on a bit too long. Good points were made, but it never really seemed to HIT. I think I would've liked a longer conversation between the two of them outside of this video. But with that one hour ticking away, I just wasn't feeling it.

Anyway, that ended and I looked at the clock and oh boy we're already halfway through. This wasn't what I expected. Hm. Oh well. Let's see where the road takes us then instead... Hollywood! This set straight up looks like the MV set of a flop kpop girl group's summer comeback single that their agency was somehow able to afford despite not having paid the electricity bill in months. And I love it. The sneak peek we got of this in Phil's video had my expectations raised.

You see, keeping with the title of the video, I thought the part of the video filmed on this set would touch upon his career. How not being proud affected his videos, but also all the other million jobs he had taken on over the years. And maybe even those he hadn't? You can't tell me he doesn't have thoughts about his time at BBCR1, with so many openly gay DJs as colleagues. I'd love to hear about it. Instead we got something about conventions and YouTube friends... I guess that is vaguely work related. But then Tyler showed up and the whole thing kinda lost me there. I saw some people criticizing Tyler being presented as 'good representation' but a white gay looking up at another white gay during those years isn't really my issue (though it is a valid one since the video was already overwhelmingly white). I don't even have a strong opinion on Tyler. It's just that the conversation added nothing for me. I think the entire thing could've ended up on the cutting room floor and it would've made no difference to the narrative of the journey. What a waste of a pretty set.

Things kinda picked up again with Abigail as Dan's fairy guardian spiritual thing, but I didn't love it. I get inserting humor into this part because Dan is allergic to things like that getting to serious and that's something we have in common. Perhaps it wasn't supposed to be very sincere at all. But I think that at that point the video actually needed some sincerity, because the jokes kinda fell flat for me. Dunno why, maybe the limitations of (I assume) separate filming? Who knows. It was good though. So many good things were said that were very important to the narrative they were supposedly going for. Just the jokes kinda had me grimace a bit.

Dan finally entering the room of his emo teenage baby self was more along the lines of what I expected in the first place. But sadly, by then the clock was ticking to get this thing over with and it felt rushed. Dan looking back at his younger self, talking about all the things that boy was going through, and then ultimately actually realizing that it isn't about that boy anymore was powerful stuff. Like I sad, we eventually got to the conclusion that he can't know for sure what would've happened if he had been proud sooner and that it doesn't matter anyway. He can't turn back time. It's better that he likes the person he is now, and he wouldn't have become him without all those experiences. It was REALLY good. Why wasn't it more like that? Why did we rush through that?? AAAAAAAH.

No it's fine, I'm fine. I don't know how much time he had preparing/writing/filming this or what his budget was, but ultimately it was a good video. No way around that. I just had very different expectations and I keep seeing all these potential roads he could've taken that would've resulted in a more powerful and cohesive narrative. I hope maybe one day he can and will want to expand on things like that? But without sets and professional camera crews. Just in front of his own camera, in a room in his forever home, edited by him. Cause if there's anything this video made me realize, it's that I miss that bastard and his videos a lot.



Oh and Phil's bits were great and significant of course, but BlueSnoko already said eveything I could ever want to say about that and then some. I actually predicted that he would be eating a snack on Twitter! Though I thought it'd be rainbow glitter glue. You know, to keep with the theme.

[scientia]

Still only half way through… but wanted to remark on his opening comments about 2021 and living his hot boy summer fantasy (and catching aspirational STDs)—same like with BIG, he has these throw away comments/jokes about sex that all but dismiss Phil. Is is just sacrificing reality of the sake of a joke? Is he really in a open relationship? lol

I admit, it’s such a silly thing to get hung up on, but a casual viewer would hear that and think, oh this dudes single—is that the perception he want to put out there?

This is something I've been thinking about as well, especially after this video. Because he spends an hour talking about all the things he missed out on because of not being out, not living as his true self etc. And I fully understand him not wanting to be open about what he and Phil are to each other after all the drama the fandom has created for them and the associated trauma. But then there is a disconnect between Dan making these jokes and the moments we see with him and Phil being married™. And it makes me wonder whether there is a middle ground between him being authentic and honest about these things and not revealing enough for the sake of privacy and whether that's something he'll ever work up to. Or whether we're interpreting thigns wrong

I agree with your sentiments here! That boundary between preserving privacy but also finally feeling free to be open and out is probably a moving target. I do think there has to be a point where we take Dan's words at face value...the more he keeps mentioning wanting to have a hot boy summer and meet daddies or whatever, the more I'm inclined to believe that's what he wants to be doing with his life.

[alittledizzy]

Dan's joke about how he wanted to live his "hot boy summer 'gay and proud' fantasy by mingling and probably tingling from all the aspirational STDs he'd catch" is the style of joke that he does that is an exaggeration of the truth. Just like how he's previously said he's so tired of being cooped up because of covid that when it's over he wants to go the park and lick a lamp post and hug people's legs (or something like that lol). Based on what we know about Dan Howell, it seems highly unlikely that he's actually going to run around licking lamp posts, just like it seems highly unlikely that he's going to go around having unprotected sex in the hopes of catching lots of STDs. I think there's truth in wanting a hot boy summer, just like there's truth in him wanting to be a bit more social after covid restrictions, but it probably just means doing the stuff like he mentioned with Tyler, like going to a gay bar and singing Lady Gaga at the top of his lungs with other gay people and just having fun without having to worry about being outed.

Regarding what he wants people to perceive his relationship with Phil as, dnp know anyone that is invested in them is aware of what they mean to each other and I'm guessing at this point they view outsider's opinions on their relationship as irrelevant.

And as far as Dan wanting to be "authentic" yet keeping his personal life private, I think there's nothing more "authentic' to dnp than protecting their relationship and one of the current ways they do this is to not publicly discuss it (you'll have to go to Cornelia another ice cream shop if you want any scoops )

This is pretty much how I feel. I do understand the idea that you have to take words he keeps repeating at face value, and Dan is someone that jokes endlessly about things that have a ring of truth. I also do think he wants some sexual attention and to have a hot boy summer, but I agree with you that there's more to that than hooking up with strangers and getting STDs! Also it just doesn't mesh with my concept of Dan and Phil that they would go from people that keep everything about their personal/private lives private, to Dan being someone who loudly broadcasts the when and where and how of his sexual intentions. I don't mean to sound like I'm negative toward open relationships, I just look at Dan and Phil and what we know of them and... it doesn't click for me with anything else about them. Just because I can't imagine it doesn't mean it isn't true, and everything we say on here is speculation, but I also tend to trust my gut with things like this.

And I guess also, for me, the thing Dan said that always does ring truest is the one that I wouldn't expect him to repeat (or think he'd need to) about he and Phil keeping their private life private. He said it once (twice if you count saying he won't talk for Phil) and Phil said it once (ice cream shops!) and that's that boundary both laid out for them.

[anna_begins]

Finally some proof that people actually won the ywgttn merch and Dan video shoutout: