Dan & Phil Part 23: Let's just retract the fist.

[uglyamerican]

SU2C: I think Dan might be overreacting to the "whiteness" of the promos thus far - is there a controversy about this in the UK? Dan should reflect on his tour audiences Anyway, people should be judged by the content of their character, and not by the color of their skin (I stole this from MLK, soz.)

I don't think Dan was reacting to the Stand up to cancer promo in general but to that specific tweet:

It turns out it was maybe someone posting that without really thinking it through but honestly in a campaign that plays on that inclusive image of "the whole of youtube" and the "whole of youtube audience" all united against cancer, it is really indelicate to have 0 POC in the montage.

Yep, lots of "whitespace" in that Twitter posting. However, take a gander of the Gleam Futures front page:

http://www.gleamfutures.com/

Narry a person of color represented there (ok, maybe one asian....)

And Flipside is hardly better:

http://www.flipsidetalent.com/ (look under the talent tab.)

Even the "talent" agencies are "guilty" it seems. The ironic thing is that SU2C was started by high profile women in the entertainment business.

[melon lord]

Same, I love Avatar, makes me want to rewatch it. I'm glad they're enjoying it, hoping for future Dan waffles about the character development.

I hope so too, I am absolute Avatar trash so hearing them mention it made me so excited. I think I need to bust out my boxset and have a marathon.

If they go through Zuko's arc and don't feel a smidge of emotions I need to reevaluate life. And we don't talk about Uncle Iroh in that one episode

A person in the chat ask him who is his fav avatar character, and then Dan talks a bit about how avatar is so good and then move on without mentioning who is his fav so far. I hate him so much. book two is Earth, is it? my fav is Bumi

Yeah I wish he answered, I was on the edge of my seat holding my breath and then was very disappointed. Bumi is amazing! There are no take backsies in my kingdom!

I'm gonna sound judgmental but seeing the fans now spam comments on Youtube just shows how goddamn dense they are. I can't deal with them most of the time. Do they not understand when he's grilling them to NOT do something? As Louise poingnantly said in one video, "are we actually stupid?" They probably each think "lololol this is so hilarious he'll think this is funny" and in reality the entirety of the internet is like

[jo_angel]

SU2C: I think Dan might be overreacting to the "whiteness" of the promos thus far - is there a controversy about this in the UK? Dan should reflect on his tour audiences Anyway, people should be judged by the content of their character, and not by the color of their skin (I stole this from MLK, soz.)

I don't think Dan was reacting to the Stand up to cancer promo in general but to that specific tweet:

It turns out it was maybe someone posting that without really thinking it through but honestly in a campaign that plays on that inclusive image of "the whole of youtube" and the "whole of youtube audience" all united against cancer, it is really indelicate to have 0 POC in the montage.

Yep, lots of "whitespace" in that Twitter posting. However, take a gander of the Gleam Futures front

Narry a person of color represented there (ok, maybe one asian....)

And Flipside is hardly better:

(look under the talent tab.)

Even the "talent" agencies are "guilty" it seems. The ironic thing is that SU2C was started by high profile women in the entertainment business.

From what I understand, thats exactly it though. The overwhelming whiteness of big YouTubers - like those represented by gleam and flip side- is not an excuse for the whiteness of the campaign but the reason for it. There is undeniably a substantial presence of people of colour on YouTube, as creators and as viewers, but that isn't well represented in the mainstream. While it's difficult to address the disparities in popularity (I think? I'm sorry if this is ignorant it's just off the top of my head I can't think of anything that can systematically be done on a platform like YouTube for better representation other than community led promotions maybe??), an organisation/event like stand up to cancer could, and should in my opinion, very easily engage with more than just the standard white mass of YouTube.

Sorry if this is wrong or out of my lane to say. Or just too waffly and makes no sense
Also if the formatting doesn't work I have no idea what I'm doing

[antigone]

So Onision referenced Dan's liveshow

Link below spoiler in case you really don't want to see Onision lol (can't blame you)

Starts 1:01

[daphenaxa]

SU2C: I think Dan might be overreacting to the "whiteness" of the promos thus far - is there a controversy about this in the UK? Dan should reflect on his tour audiences Anyway, people should be judged by the content of their character, and not by the color of their skin (I stole this from MLK, soz.)

I don't think Dan was reacting to the Stand up to cancer promo in general but to that specific tweet:

It turns out it was maybe someone posting that without really thinking it through but honestly in a campaign that plays on that inclusive image of "the whole of youtube" and the "whole of youtube audience" all united against cancer, it is really indelicate to have 0 POC in the montage.

Yep, lots of "whitespace" in that Twitter posting. However, take a gander of the Gleam Futures front page:

http://www.gleamfutures.com/

Narry a person of color represented there (ok, maybe one asian....)

And Flipside is hardly better:

http://www.flipsidetalent.com/ (look under the talent tab.)

Even the "talent" agencies are "guilty" it seems. The ironic thing is that SU2C was started by high profile women in the entertainment business.

I don't get what your point is. So because talents agencies and the entertainment business in general are racist, it is ok for SU2C to be too?
Also as I said before, it is particularly indelicate to have a rooster with no diversity whatsoever when your entire campaign is based on "all against cancer". As Dan explained it was kind of an accident and not thinking it through properly but it does send a wrong message.

[melon lord]

So Onision referenced Dan's liveshow

Link below spoiler in case you really don't want to see Onision lol (can't blame you)

Starts 1:01

I bet he would watch them later because he's thirsty as heck. I'm so lucky I was never a fan of him to begin with. From the moment he opened his mouth way back then and I heard his opinions I was like "nope".

I feel legitimately bad for I know that deppy gets phanart that's sexually themed but at least it's within the borders of the phandom whereas this is "fans" responding to a shitstain's request to draw him in situations with someone else. I feel violated and squeamish and it's not even about me.

What I hate most is that no matter how dan approaches the topic, he loses. If he opens up and rants about it, that waste of semen gets more attention and just wins at riling up people. If he ignores it he has to endure these cave people completely disregard basic human respect and boundaries.

[Catallena]

I think this might be the most predictable Dan tweet ever. The moment I saw the thing about the Jet Black iPhone I just knew it was coming.

So Onision referenced Dan's liveshow

Link below spoiler in case you really don't want to see Onision lol (can't blame you)

Starts 1:01

Not watching it because I love myself more than that but wow I didn't expect that at all. Oh I did.

[antigone]

So Onision referenced Dan's liveshow

Link below spoiler in case you really don't want to see Onision lol (can't blame you)

Starts 1:01

I bet he would watch them later because he's thirsty as heck. I'm so lucky I was never a fan of him to begin with. From the moment he opened his mouth way back then and I heard his opinions I was like "nope".

I feel legitimately bad for I know that deppy gets phanart that's sexually themed but at least it's within the borders of the phandom whereas this is "fans" responding to a shitstain's request to draw him in situations with someone else. I feel violated and squeamish and it's not even about me.

What I hate most is that no matter how dan approaches the topic, he loses. If he opens up and rants about it, that waste of semen gets more attention and just wins at riling up people. If he ignores it he has to endure these cave people completely disregard basic human respect and boundaries.

Yeah that last part is what gets me. I'm not even sure Onision is doing it entirely for views but eh it works apparently. Shane's done very similar in regards to comments about Dan that were hardly respectful of a youtube 'colleague' but that does not compare to asking people to draw 'fanart'. I thought Dan's shady response was subtle enough to not get to Onision but I guess not

[confusedpanda]

So Onision referenced Dan's liveshow

Link below spoiler in case you really don't want to see Onision lol (can't blame you)

Starts 1:01

Quick transcript of what he said about Dan so that way he doesn't get anymore of the view he so badly craves.

"You know I'm starting to hate danisnotonfire. Recently he did a live broadcast and people the chat spammed Him with onions name. Yet because danisnotonfire is such a snob, he completely disregard onion entirely."

[fancybum]

So Onision referenced Dan's liveshow

Link below spoiler in case you really don't want to see Onision lol (can't blame you)

Starts 1:01

I mean, if you (or anybody) are going to do that, in the future at least summarise what was said rather than promoting another view for him. I took a bullet, all he did was say 'senpai notice me or burn in hell' essentially.

SU2C: I think Dan might be overreacting to the "whiteness" of the promos thus far - is there a controversy about this in the UK? Dan should reflect on his tour audiences Anyway, people should be judged by the content of their character, and not by the color of their skin (I stole this from MLK, soz.)

I don't think Dan was reacting to the Stand up to cancer promo in general but to that specific tweet:

It turns out it was maybe someone posting that without really thinking it through but honestly in a campaign that plays on that inclusive image of "the whole of youtube" and the "whole of youtube audience" all united against cancer, it is really indelicate to have 0 POC in the montage.

Yep, lots of "whitespace" in that Twitter posting. However, take a gander of the Gleam Futures front page:

http://www.gleamfutures.com/

Narry a person of color represented there (ok, maybe one asian....)

And Flipside is hardly better:

http://www.flipsidetalent.com/ (look under the talent tab.)

Even the "talent" agencies are "guilty" it seems. The ironic thing is that SU2C was started by high profile women in the entertainment business.

I don't get what your point is. So because talents agencies and the entertainment business in general are racist, it is ok for SU2C to be too?
Also as I said before, it is particularly indelicate to have a rooster with no diversity whatsoever when your entire campaign is based on "all against cancer". As Dan explained it was kind of an accident and not thinking it through properly but it does send a wrong message.

Seriously. What hill are you trying to die on here, uglyamerican?

[pearshaped34]

Actually you called it wrong Catallena it turns out Dan throwing shade went over enough people's heads that it didn't make it's way back to Onision because his actually calling Dan out for not acknowledging his existence when his name was spammed in the chat. Although I'm sure if he was aware of Dan;s shade he'd have mentioned that a video too so really Dan can't win. If he acknowledges him Onision has material to use and if he ignore him Onision will use being ignored as the material.

I mean, if you (or anybody) are going to do that, in the future at least summarise what was said rather than promoting another view for him. I took a bullet, all he did was say 'senpai notice me or burn in hell' essentially.

I agree if bringing up Onision briefly summarise to stop him getting views from people who are just too curious for their own good. Admittedly if it wasn't already summarised I probably would have clicked and regretted it after.

[antigone]

Thanks confusedpanda for the transcript!

[Catallena]

Actually you called it wrong Catallena it turns out Dan throwing shade went over enough people's heads that it didn't make it's way back to Onision because his actually calling Dan out for not acknowledging his existence when his name was spammed in the chat. Although I'm sure if he was aware of that he'd have mentioned in a video too but Dan can't win. If he acknowledges him Onision has material to use and if he ignore him Onision will use being ignored as the material.

Fair enough, I guess he doesn't check @replies or indirects. That surprises me tbh. Dan can 'win' if he would just continue not acknowledging him (that includes his 'subtle' shade) AND if the phandom just shut the hell up over this guy for once and for all. It's not Dan he's into, he's into the attention fans give him. Stop giving him attention and he'll get bored. But the phandom continues to be messy like always, so all we can do is wait for Onion to find a new victim.

[antigone]

Actually you called it wrong Catallena it turns out Dan throwing shade went over enough people's heads that it didn't make it's way back to Onision because his actually calling Dan out for not acknowledging his existence when his name was spammed in the chat. Although I'm sure if he was aware of that he'd have mentioned in a video too but Dan can't win. If he acknowledges him Onision has material to use and if he ignore him Onision will use being ignored as the material.

Fair enough, I guess he doesn't check @replies or indirects. That surprises me tbh. Dan can 'win' if he would just continue not acknowledging him (that includes his 'subtle' shade) AND if the phandom just shut the hell up over this guy for once and for all. It's not Dan he's into, he's into the attention fans give him. Stop giving him attention and he'll get bored. But the phandom continues to be messy like always, so all we can do is wait for Onion to find a new victim.

I can't see Onision shutting up about it. I didn't really know about the guy until recently but it appears he's been mentioning Dan in videos for about 3 years so I don't see why he would randomly stop. I mean he even used the guy in his 'coming out as Biromantic' video, which just proves how low he will go tbh

[pearshaped34]

I'd also prefer Dan didn't acknowledge Onision at all as you don't beat a troll by giving it the attention it wanted in the first place but nobody has the power to stop the phandom/phandom trolls feeding him and that will likely always be enough to fuel Onision so yeah no matter what Dan does he affectively can't win and Onision will continue to focus on him.

But yeah I'm with you that Dan himself shouldn't throw shade or acknowledge his existence at all. Mostly for the same reason I don't think he should have tried/read out comments about the nail polish once he has reacted to something the fans don't back off it they focus on it more.

[melon lord]

You're right in that, I just feel that Dan should have the right to express his discomfort in how fucked up this situation is, honestly. We always try to encourage victims of bullying to stand up and speak out, so I feel that Dan should have the stage and his moment to say "fuck you guys and fuck this one guy in particular".

I get it, publicity and PR, I really do. It's a tough balance. And it will bring attention to that curdled turd. But it seems awfully unfair that Dan has to stay silent and be the "butt" (no offense intended) of his jokes and the victim of the fandom's stupidity just because "don't feed the trolls". The problem is that the troll is feeding itself anyway and shitting all over Dan no matter what he says and does. At least speaking up about it and/or making a statement would be more of a loud stance against this sort of thing.

Lbr, onion is a fucking idiot. But the fans are worse and nobody so far is calling them out on their behaviour. If Dan, the person whose 2012 replies got the phandom arguing among themselves over who is "good" and who is "bad", actually called it out for what it is and said "this is messed up and you should feel bad" then I would applaud, honestly. I'm not holding back the applause for his silence, mind you. It's tough and I admire that he's kept it so lowkey so far.

[Sakura Selfie]

As fancybum pointed out, onion literally asked for Dan to notice him in the video, he's like a toddler throwing a tantrum because he can't get something he wants and tbh I think he's only going to ramp up his efforts to force Dan to publicly acknowledge him in some way. I sincerely hope I'm wrong though.

[fancybum]

Can a licensed British person contextualize this please? Is it significant, does it mean anything? Because no offense to Jack and Dean, if they're there, Dan & Phil deserve to be there. I mean maybe they were invited and weren't into it, idk. I googled and only found the top 25 of this list, is it not released yet or something? What's happening.

[Amelie]

[offtopic][/offtopic]I just saw this in dans twitter likes and thought it was interesting. The caption was "dan, you look like a dad' (Sorry, I have no idea how to embed tweets). How would 2012 Dan feel now

[mez29]

Can a licensed British person contextualize this please? Is it significant, does it mean anything? Because no offense to Jack and Dean, if they're there, Dan & Phil deserve to be there. I mean maybe they were invited and weren't into it, idk. I googled and only found the top 25 of this list, is it not released yet or something? What's happening.

Interesting. I had a look at the various lists they've got and couldn't find Jack and Dean, or Dan and Phil, so I suppose we'll have to wait for the full list which is apparently being "announced tonight". D & P were in the list in 2013 (as a joint entry lol) for their Radio 1 work: http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/t ... 26595.html
[As a certified British person I don't think this is that important … like I think I've heard of it but I'm pretty sure it's not a thing anyone cares about?]

[000dia000]

Can a licensed British person contextualize this please? Is it significant, does it mean anything? Because no offense to Jack and Dean, if they're there, Dan & Phil deserve to be there. I mean maybe they were invited and weren't into it, idk. I googled and only found the top 25 of this list, is it not released yet or something? What's happening.

I did not find anything to do with jack, dean or deppy, for that matter.
However, I did note the Sugg siblings were under the Literary list:
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/the1000/ ... 37211.html
So TIL you can become one of the most influential authors in all of London by using a ghost writer with this logic deppy are probably under a sporting category for that one time they decided to Go Outside™

[fancybum]

Interesting. I had a look at the various lists they've got and couldn't find Jack and Dean, or Dan and Phil, so I suppose we'll have to wait for the full list which is apparently being "announced tonight". D & P were in the list in 2013 (as a joint entry lol) for their Radio 1 work: http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/t ... 26595.html
[As a certified British person I don't think this is that important … like I think I've heard of it but I'm pretty sure it's not a thing anyone cares about?]

Oh god I hope they don't just force everybody to hear the full list at that dinner lol, have fun Jack & Dean.

However, I did note the Sugg siblings were under the Literary list:
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/the1000/ ... 37211.html
So TIL you can become one of the most influential authors in all of London by using a ghost writer with this logic deppy are probably under a sporting category for that one time they decided to Go Outside™

Thanks guys!
Again, no offense to J&D, it's not fair to stack people in terms of relevance/numbers but I'm assuming they're on that list for their JADOAT series on Fullscreen? (because what else have they got going on atm as a duo..?). But for viewer numbers alone, surely more people went to see D&P on tour than signed up for the Fullscreen app to watch that series, right? And of course strictly going by numbers on social media, D&P 'win', so it would be strange if they weren't on that list (meaningless though it may be). I'm curious what ranking they'll be at! (If any).
Tbh I just want an excuse to see them in suits again is all. How dare they skip some hoity-toity dinner if they were invited and deprive us of the pictures.

[uglyamerican]

I don't get what your point is. So because talents agencies and the entertainment business in general are racist, it is ok for SU2C to be too?
Also as I said before, it is particularly indelicate to have a rooster with no diversity whatsoever when your entire campaign is based on "all against cancer". As Dan explained it was kind of an accident and not thinking it through properly but it does send a wrong message.

No, basically the irony of Dan (and Tom Ska apparently) complaining about the monochromatic makeup of the tweet, when their own representation are essentially "guilty" of the same lack of diversity. You know, "those who live in glass houses should cast no stones." FTR, I don't think anybody involved is racist, and certainly not SU2C as evidenced by their banner page. Anyway, I don't see much coverage of any controversy surrounding the tweet, and the original photographer is mum on the subject, so it seems some people are getting bent out of shape... just because.

[Philena]

Slightly ot, but would love to hear Dan play True Love Waits, not for any romantic notions, but because of the syncopation that makes a deceptively easy sounding song that much more difficult. Kudos to him if he can play and sing at the same time! Also, was low key annoyed that he implied he and Thom Yorke have a similar level of piano skills. Let's hear some of your original compositions, Daniel.

I liked Phil's Mario tweet today! He seemed excited.

[daphenaxa]

I don't get what your point is. So because talents agencies and the entertainment business in general are racist, it is ok for SU2C to be too?
Also as I said before, it is particularly indelicate to have a rooster with no diversity whatsoever when your entire campaign is based on "all against cancer". As Dan explained it was kind of an accident and not thinking it through properly but it does send a wrong message.

No, basically the irony of Dan (and Tom Ska apparently) complaining about the monochromatic makeup of the tweet, when their own representation are essentially "guilty" of the same lack of diversity. You know, "those who live in glass houses should cast no stones." FTR, I don't think anybody involved is racist, and certainly not SU2C as evidenced by their banner page. Anyway, I don't see much coverage of any controversy surrounding the tweet, and the original photographer is mum on the subject, so it seems some people are getting bent out of shape... just because.

so people who are privileged and aware of it should just shut the fuck and be thankful instead of speaking up when they know something is not fair?

I still don't get how you parallel Dan speaking up about a bad tweet from SU2C in a project he is involved in, with Dan's ex management business decisions or with TATINOF audience (which was actually more mixed than I would have expected).

Your digs about things out of Dan's control to legitimate a poorly thought out and executed SU2C tweet are just really weird.