Dan & Phil Part 31: You're stuck with me for life

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gnostic
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Phil Fuckin' Lester posting phan and engagement confirmation with thinly veiled phandom clues? Like, all other issues aside. Come on, IDB. We are better than this
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gnostic wrote:Phil Fuckin' Lester posting phan and engagement confirmation with thinly veiled phandom clues? Like, all other issues aside. Come on, IDB. We are better than this
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I thought I was going loopy for a minute. We have plenty of canon evidence of these two being committed to each other for life as it is.
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I want to bring back the pinof8 tag topic because it made me think again about Dan’s attitude in the fanfiction live section of tatinof.
malday wrote:I have a pretty high tolerance for stupidity on the internet but the amount of unfiltered queer fetishization and "Dance, Monkey, Dance !"that i've seen in tweets and comments after this ls has put me off of PINOF forever
This is basically what they illustrated in the Fanfiction Live section of Tatinof. The crowd demands that Phil draw Dan like a French girl; the narrator demands that Dan undress. Dan becomes increasingly grumpy, until he draws the line and refuses to co-operate.

Meanwhile in an alternative universe in which the crowd asks for the seemingly less homoerotic options: space rather than camping, and cake rather than erotic drawing, what they get is more suggestive.

The message I take away from that: ask, and you shall not receive. Hold back in what you demand, and you may be surprised by what you are shown.
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BisexualShoeMarriage wrote:I want to bring back the pinof8 tag topic because it made me think again about Dan’s attitude in the fanfiction live section of tatinof.
malday wrote:I have a pretty high tolerance for stupidity on the internet but the amount of unfiltered queer fetishization and "Dance, Monkey, Dance !"that i've seen in tweets and comments after this ls has put me off of PINOF forever
This is basically what they illustrated in the Fanfiction Live section of Tatinof. The crowd demands that Phil draw Dan like a French girl; the narrator demands that Dan undress. Dan becomes increasingly grumpy, until he draws the line and refuses to co-operate.

Meanwhile in an alternative universe in which the crowd asks for the seemingly less homoerotic options: space rather than camping, and cake rather than erotic drawing, what they get is more suggestive.

The message I take away from that: ask, and you shall not receive. Hold back in what you demand, and you may be surprised by what you are shown.
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BisexualShoeMarriage wrote:I want to bring back the pinof8 tag topic because it made me think again about Dan’s attitude in the fanfiction live section of tatinof.
malday wrote:I have a pretty high tolerance for stupidity on the internet but the amount of unfiltered queer fetishization and "Dance, Monkey, Dance !"that i've seen in tweets and comments after this ls has put me off of PINOF forever
This is basically what they illustrated in the Fanfiction Live section of Tatinof. The crowd demands that Phil draw Dan like a French girl; the narrator demands that Dan undress. Dan becomes increasingly grumpy, until he draws the line and refuses to co-operate.

Meanwhile in an alternative universe in which the crowd asks for the seemingly less homoerotic options: space rather than camping, and cake rather than erotic drawing, what they get is more suggestive.

The message I take away from that: ask, and you shall not receive. Hold back in what you demand, and you may be surprised by what you are shown.
I agree. Other collabs like the baking videos have eclipsed the PINOF series, because there's no audience involved and while it may be bit fanservicey at times it's far more genuine than PINOF has become. They're enjoying themselves and each other in that moment and it's beautiful to watch. PINOF ain't the same anymore, people abuse the right to ask questions (there are barely any silly questions anymore actually it's mostly 'Dan do this, Phil do this, reenact this thing' instead of a balance between the two) and it ends up forced and not as good as the first few.
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BisexualShoeMarriage wrote:I want to bring back the pinof8 tag topic because it made me think again about Dan’s attitude in the fanfiction live section of tatinof.
malday wrote:I have a pretty high tolerance for stupidity on the internet but the amount of unfiltered queer fetishization and "Dance, Monkey, Dance !"that i've seen in tweets and comments after this ls has put me off of PINOF forever
This is basically what they illustrated in the Fanfiction Live section of Tatinof. The crowd demands that Phil draw Dan like a French girl; the narrator demands that Dan undress. Dan becomes increasingly grumpy, until he draws the line and refuses to co-operate.

Meanwhile in an alternative universe in which the crowd asks for the seemingly less homoerotic options: space rather than camping, and cake rather than erotic drawing, what they get is more suggestive.

The message I take away from that: ask, and you shall not receive. Hold back in what you demand, and you may be surprised by what you are shown.
I think this is the sensible subtext we've all been looking for brilliant observation, actually

Aspects of that user profile as well as information and locations, are interesting, I'm not going to deny. But we would be tinhatting if we thought this was actually them leaving a breadcrumb trail across the internet (who am I fucking kidding they already did that in 2009 ffs.)
I mean, we can argue about how the phandom should behave but a mutual agreement within this forum does not equate an agreement with other social media platforms. However, I do agree with the theory of the above statement: hunker down and wait, otherwise the more we push and press for something to happen, the slower this "something" will come.
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Lain wrote:@ sinnamonrollphil - but do you really think Phil is capable of such abysmal spelling and grammar? :lol:
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There are many more errors in the full reviews, as well.
i was thinking the same thing- phil would never post something w/ that grammar

+4 for a phannie trolling
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For me baking videod and ditl are better than pinof, I like pinof for the tradition factor
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Just watched Hazel's latest instalment of Time of The Month, I am still amazed at how different social/professional life compared to the London youtubers.
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Trashcan101
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So I've lurked here for quite a bit without actually posting anything, but finally decided to make an account because what do I have to lose.

So I have two things - the first being pinof. While I do enjoy the tradition aspect of it, it really just feels forced at this point. Baking videos are becoming a tradition and yet they're still pretty genuine, so I can't really see the tradition aspect playing a huge role. Even Dan said in a liveshow once he wishes they only did it once because he's kind of sick of it (or something like that) and I can't blame him/them. It just has become too fanservicey and too much of trying to appeal to the younger and still cringe phandom, the new age phannies of sort.

Also, quick bant on younow. I noticed this in the last joint liveshow, what is with that wonderfullyrachel girl? A couple people are saying on the phanshows recently how she and dan are on a first name basis or whatever, am I the only one who finds it a tad creepy? I wasn't around much on younow when anahita was that person, was this what it was like with her? I can't imagine spending that much money on something like that honestly. I also found it slightly funny how when they answered a question or something from her, dan said "Rach" and phil just almost mumbled her user, and seemed to really quickly want to pass over the question. The only thing that stopped him was dan declaring that she wasn't number 1. Wonder what that's about
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Re: possible Deppy engagement
I don't get why the phandom thinks an engagement would even be a thing for . These are people who have been together (in whatever sense of “together” you want to construe it) for seven years, and who have literally used the word “forever” about each other. I can see them having a “let's get married” conversation in the same way they've had a “let's get a koi pond” conversation (but really, what would be the difference?). I can also see one or both of them making a romantic gesture (e.g., going to Japan) to mark a deepened commitment to their relationship. But whatever form an “engagement” would take, it would just be part of the process for two people who have demonstrably been in it for the long haul. I can't imagine one of them dropping to a knee and surprising the other with a ring—that's pure phanfiction.

When I see fluttering about “engagement”, what I see is the phandom wanting an engagement to happen because 1) it would confirm phan and 2) it would open the door to massive stalking over the presumed upcoming wedding.

I can't imagine Deppy inviting that level of stalking and intrusiveness. They'd be crazy to tell us about a wedding (or any marriage—they may not even want to do the whole “wedding” thing, who knows) until after the fact.

And who knows, maybe they will decide for whatever reasons that “marriage is just a piece of paper” that they don't need or want. They can make all the forever they want without it.
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Moderating
Trashcan101 wrote:Also, quick bant on younow. I noticed this in the last joint liveshow, what is with that wonderfullyrachel girl? A couple people are saying on the phanshows recently how she and dan are on a first name basis or whatever, am I the only one who finds it a tad creepy? I wasn't around much on younow when anahita was that person, was this what it was like with her? I can't imagine spending that much money on something like that honestly. I also found it slightly funny how when they answered a question or something from her, dan said "Rach" and phil just almost mumbled her user, and seemed to really quickly want to pass over the question. The only thing that stopped him was dan declaring that she wasn't number 1. Wonder what that's about
Hi there, Trashcan101.

The moderators have discovered that you are "wonderfullyrachel", and have joined IDB in order to deceive the users here. Unfortunately, this is trolling, so I have banned your account. Do not register any more accounts.

Here is our What to Do if You've Been Banned thread, should you wish to discuss this further in private.
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LeftHandedism wrote:Re: possible Deppy engagement
I don't get why the phandom thinks an engagement would even be a thing for . These are people who have been together (in whatever sense of “together” you want to construe it) for seven years, and who have literally used the word “forever” about each other. I can see them having a “let's get married” conversation in the same way they've had a “let's get a koi pond” conversation (but really, what would be the difference?). I can also see one or both of them making a romantic gesture (e.g., going to Japan) to mark a deepened commitment to their relationship. But whatever form an “engagement” would take, it would just be part of the process for two people who have demonstrably been in it for the long haul. I can't imagine one of them dropping to a knee and surprising the other with a ring—that's pure phanfiction.

When I see fluttering about “engagement”, what I see is the phandom wanting an engagement to happen because 1) it would confirm phan and 2) it would open the door to massive stalking over the presumed upcoming wedding.

I can't imagine Deppy inviting that level of stalking and intrusiveness. They'd be crazy to tell us about a wedding (or any marriage—they may not even want to do the whole “wedding” thing, who knows) until after the fact.

And who knows, maybe they will decide for whatever reasons that “marriage is just a piece of paper” that they don't need or want. They can make all the forever they want without it.
I get what you mean. I definitely feel that when if D&P ever get engaged it'll be more of a "hey, do you want to get engaged?" "okay" and then they go out and get rings for each other the next day type thing, rather than some sort of flash mob proposal complete with Phil having a dance solo. That being said, I wouldn't necessarily say it's ridiculous to think that one of them might propose to the other at a nice dinner or something of the sort. I do agree I don't think it would be a "surprise" to either of them though.
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Trashcan101 wrote:So I have two things - the first being pinof. While I do enjoy the tradition aspect of it, it really just feels forced at this point. Baking videos are becoming a tradition and yet they're still pretty genuine, so I can't really see the tradition aspect playing a huge role. Even Dan said in a liveshow once he wishes they only did it once because he's kind of sick of it (or something like that) and I can't blame him/them. It just has become too fanservicey and too much of trying to appeal to the younger and still cringe phandom, the new age phannies of sort.
Just to clarify, if any lurker is reading this, I'm going to quote mysterylovescompany from a past thread. http://indepthbants.com/post38968.html#p38968
mysterylovescompany wrote: Just want to point out that Dan DIDN'T say in his ls that he wished they'd only ever made one pinof! He said that he wished they'd made one a year instead of several so quickly in the first few years. However, the comment made me frown, because there has only ever been one pinof a year, even if they haven't always been at the same time of year (Oct 2009, May 2010, Nov 2011, Sept 2012, Nov 2013, Nov 2014, Nov 2015). Maybe he wishes they made pinof2 later in the year, or he got the pinofs mixed up with the AmazingDan videos (May 2010, Dec 2010).
Liveshow: https://youtu.be/bG9R5ZzSc18?t=26m40s - 26:40
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Jesp wrote:Moderating
Trashcan101 wrote:Also, quick bant on younow. I noticed this in the last joint liveshow, what is with that wonderfullyrachel girl? A couple people are saying on the phanshows recently how she and dan are on a first name basis or whatever, am I the only one who finds it a tad creepy? I wasn't around much on younow when anahita was that person, was this what it was like with her? I can't imagine spending that much money on something like that honestly. I also found it slightly funny how when they answered a question or something from her, dan said "Rach" and phil just almost mumbled her user, and seemed to really quickly want to pass over the question. The only thing that stopped him was dan declaring that she wasn't number 1. Wonder what that's about
Hi there, Trashcan101.

The moderators have discovered that you are "wonderfullyrachel", and have joined IDB in order to deceive the users here. Unfortunately, this is trolling, so I have banned your account. Do not register any more accounts.

Here is our What to Do if You've Been Banned thread, should you wish to discuss this further in private.
this is the funniest thing that has happened on idb in weeks, thanks rach

(sorry for the offtopic but this deserved a comment, also i have nothing to say about the tripadvisor thing bc that's obviously a phannie having fun i don't get how we're considering it could possibly be true)
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Dan Howell wrote:'[someone] just sent me a message saying 'Phil'..... same'
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Jesp wrote:Moderating
Trashcan101 wrote:Also, quick bant on younow. I noticed this in the last joint liveshow, what is with that wonderfullyrachel girl? A couple people are saying on the phanshows recently how she and dan are on a first name basis or whatever, am I the only one who finds it a tad creepy? I wasn't around much on younow when anahita was that person, was this what it was like with her? I can't imagine spending that much money on something like that honestly. I also found it slightly funny how when they answered a question or something from her, dan said "Rach" and phil just almost mumbled her user, and seemed to really quickly want to pass over the question. The only thing that stopped him was dan declaring that she wasn't number 1. Wonder what that's about
Hi there, Trashcan101.

The moderators have discovered that you are "wonderfullyrachel", and have joined IDB in order to deceive the users here. Unfortunately, this is trolling, so I have banned your account. Do not register any more accounts.

Here is our What to Do if You've Been Banned thread, should you wish to discuss this further in private.
i'm sorry i know this is serious modding action but i'm CRYING this is the funniest thing i've seen in WEEKS
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Catallena wrote:Ignoring the TripAdvisor review troll discussion for a bit, I'm gonna go back to Dan being or not being narcissistic for a real quick second because of you are teeny bit hypocritical about this tbh :?

Suffering from social anxiety doesn't mean that Dan can't perform, do public speaking, be loud etc. You're all right about that, I have experience with that myself (major social anxiety but don't have too much trouble with public speaking as long as I've rehearsed my stuff and got consistently high grades for it throughout school). But you can't completely turn around and then say that Dan's behavior can't be narcissism because he suffers from social anxiety. Those things can very much go hand in hand, socially anxious people can even have narcissistic personality disorder (which I don't think Dan has, just proving a point here) and in my opinion there are ways in which the two are quite similar; when you want to be really simple about it without any nuance you could say that both are an obsession with what people think of you. There's more differences of course, but I think that similarity is really important to keep in mind sometimes.

Having narcissist traits doesn't need to mean you're a terrible self absorbed person who doesn't care about others but only about themselves. I think YouTubers are all a bit narcissistic... you have to be at least a little bit of a narcissist do it I think. Looking at your face and listen to your voice for hours while editing and then putting it out there... I don't know if Dan's anti social behavior has anything to do with a narcissistic personality, but I wouldn't rule it out so quickly as is done here. If Dan not liking social situations equals social anxiety why can't him loving attention equal narcissism? Because people think of the latter as something negative?
Y'all are so articulate, honestly! I bolded some of my fave bits of your post; really enjoying everyone's narcissism vs social anxiety posts, simply because I find anything remotely psychological regarding Deppy fascinating, lol.
And also sending my love to all you fellow social anxiety sufferers

OMG that moderation though
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thanks rachel, needed a laugh.

On trip advisor: I wonder what it is about this particular round of rumors concerning the trip advisor that made it such a discussion. Can't help but feel like if this had come up a year ago we all would've brushed it off as another fan much more quickly but with the way this year's been going who can say? Oh 2016, how you've challenged my standards of what to believe.

Also hey there! new poster, long time lurker, the usual :D
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I don't think it's a phannie trolling I think it's probably just a regular ole guy named Michael from the UK who has no idea who dan and phil are or what "this is the most fun ive ever had" is...that's not the most obscure phrase to ever be said.
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collbeez wrote:thanks rachel, needed a laugh.

On trip advisor: I wonder what it is about this particular round of rumors concerning the trip advisor that made it such a discussion. Can't help but feel like if this had come up a year ago we all would've brushed it off as another fan much more quickly but with the way this year's been going who can say? Oh 2016, how you've challenged my standards of what to believe.

Also hey there! new poster, long time lurker, the usual :D
I think the reason it's a discussion pretty much across the whole of the phandom right now isn't just because of the way this year is going but the fact that this somehow seemingly went hidden for literally almost three months to the date. If this was some phandom member doing elaborate hoaxing like it seems, shouldn't it have been found or leaked back in early September? Maybe it's just a coincidence from some random person, but with the "most fun I've ever had" quote in it, it could just make it seem less of a coincidence and more of a hoax. Ether way, it's just odd and intriguing. And also what adds to it is that according to phil, he does review places he goes to/visits on sites like yelp (there is a liveshow where he mentions it. I'm not sure if it was last year or this year) and he did say he doesn't use his real name to review. Also let's be real, most of the phandom is actually just trying to keep themselves entertained until they drop PINOF.
Honestly, to me, it's not actually dan or phil. It's just a coincidence or hoax hidden for months til now.
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('new age phannies' ...what a turn of phrase.)

On PINOF, I like the tradition aspect of it, this simple irreverent take on a standard Q&A that went on to symbolize the inagural moment in time when they started formally collaborating as colleagues and friends and generally summarized who they were as people.
I was going to liken it to a kind of favorite holiday you look forward to every year even though you know to expect the same traditions and decorations, but it's become so meaningful for a variety of reasons you tend not to care how 'overdone' it seems, it still has personal significance.
At the same time, I think it's that question of personal significance that might just be what's soured the appeal of it over time, in that PINOF becomes more about satisfying the whims of the individual than allowing to be as they are naturally, as they do in the baking and DITL vids like Catallena said. Where now it seems to be more about forcing interactions and goading replies for the satisfaction of the viewer than allowing them the freedom to make something for themselves and surprising us in the process without having to worry about keeping to the 'script' the audience makes for them.

I think if the current theme of questions is more densely populated by requests for them to act out viewer fantasies or answer controversial questions that are geared more to provoke a negative reaction than anything else, then maybe, if rebranding is a definite plan for the future, they might think of rehashing PINOF as well or who knows if this might be the last one, letting this PINOF bookend the year they finished the tour and mark the beginning of whatever new direction they might take themselves and their channels in the year to come.
If that were the case, I'd hate to see it go, but if they're not as enthused anymore or if they think sifting through those types of questions is more trouble than it's worth anymore, rather than allowing it to become a 'chore' than something genuinely enjoyable, maybe they should finally let the curtain fall on it.
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oh i forgot to say: for the pinof8 questions, go fucking ham, make as many kissing jokes as you want, however they do NOT belong in the tag that dan and phil themselves are going to look through. Come on people. Go ahead and joke about it but why do you need to tag it. you know they're not going to do it so come on. there's no point and it's just clogging up the tag and making it harder for dan and phil to find actual questions never mind possibly making them uncomfortable (although I agree, it must not make them very uncomfortable at this point)
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Since there's not much other conversation happening, I'm grabbing a couple of quotes from the reviews of the tatinof berlin show thread.
missemma wrote:It looked to us, at the end of the second show, that Phil didn't look very well. He looked like he was having difficulty focusing, he kept stumbling a little and looked tired and just not 100%. The first show started quite late so as we were leaving the next VIP queue was already going in, maybe he was just tired from m&g-performing-m&g-performing with only 2.5 hours in between. I mean, he might have been fine but just a few of us noticed that he didn't quite seem right, we could be completely wrong but hope he gets some rest.
hollyphan wrote:others pointed out, phil seemed sick and looked like he's about to vomit or so, and when I think back at the situation, it could be so. would explain why he was so concentrated and only stared straight ahead, an why dan might have looked so much to him because worried? who knows.
I hope Phil's feeling better today. He's talked about having bad headaches before, I wonder if he got hit with a migraine on show day?
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I don't know, to me they just looked both overwhelmed after TIIH, but super happy - they smiled at each other when the lights went off and Dan couldn't stop grinning. Exhausted, but happy. I could be wrong, of course, it didn't cross my mind that Phil looked sick until I read the opinions here.
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