Dan & Phil Part 84: Still Alive

[noodlebum]

i think a live show would be a disaster i really hope he doesn’t do that, unless it’s a joint one and phil can field comments for him

True, it might be Defensive Dan coming out in a liveshow like after living my truth. But unless his next video includes a little catch-up of the last few months (well, year) for him, it could be good to engage with his audience directly first (or am I crazy? )

[sapienveneficus]

i think a live show would be a disaster i really hope he doesn’t do that, unless it’s a joint one and phil can field comments for him

They could do another mukbang (just throwing stuff out there)

[flarequake]

On what they do all day, Phil said a few years ago (in Tabinof?) that his videos take about 5 hours to edit, so there’s that for when he’s filmed one and maybe it takes him a while to plan, prepare and also film, I don’t know. Dan said he’s spent 30 hours on a video, so approaching a week’s worth of work time for a 9-5er. Beyond that I don’t have much to add except that after the hectic year they’ve had, I can imagine Phil might also be taking time for a break/reset/think or maybe one or both of them is indeed working on something, or more than one thing, for the future. Gah, I’d really love more insight into what goes on behind the scenes, but have done for years now, it’s so interesting to hear more about it all (I shall keep watching my art vloggers for that).

[fancybum]

Uh I’m putting in a vote for Yes to a Dan solo liveshow, it’ll be more honest than a joint one because Phil would be avoidant of any real topics (or downplay things). Dan on his own (if we have to pick) is what I’d prefer. Of course the ‘why not both’ option would be preferable in an ideal world where they cared one bit about what the audience wants, but it’s 2019 and they don’t, and it isn’t.

Dan and Phil are professional entertainers who aren't currently producing content (well, Phil's making 1 video every 10 days or so so we can subtract 2-3 hours from his schedule every 10 days) so the question remains, what do they do all day? Anyone want to hazard a guess?

Count their money while laughing maniacally between Mario Kart rounds?

(It’s what I’d do )

edit: just saw Tomska’s merch store bit it; probably would have been better off sticking with IRL in hindsight. Wonder if he’ll end up with them this year?

Do you reckon they're building one of those Scrooge McDuck style money pools in the forever home?

Right next to the koi pond, I hope.

[liola]

I've been going back and forth the entire day about posting here or not, I'll be honest.

I've been very vocal for the past 3 months that I'm frustrated at Dan. He's been completely awol of any communication up to the other day, and I while I didn't mind his joke yesterday, I'm not surprised of the reaction it caused. To me it had the opposite reaction because fucking finally he addressed the issue in a straightforward matter rather than a tumblr post or a twitter reply under an account that only a few will see. That said, I have that sentiment because he prefaced that joke with 2 days of interactions and a pic where he showed that he is indeed more than a few words on a screen.

But let's not fool ourselves. Some people are babying and coddling Dan - just like some people used to do it with Phil too. I very much dislike the narrative that he's been dealing with a depressive episode for 3 months and that's why we have to be gentle with him - as someone who is currently having an episode and struggling to focus at work, it makes me feel angry on his behalf. He's still capable of being a human and doing things and if he really was in such a low point that it lasted 3 consecutive months, he'd have the money, the means and the support system to do things about it. He's had his usual bounds of relatable tweets every 10 days in these 3 months, so clearly he had the strenght to type something. He could've used that strenght to say something before yesterday.

He didn't and that's his right but it's also our right as fans to be upset by this lack of communication. Personally, as someone who really and I mean really doesn't care if he posts a video or not, all of this feel rather bland. But i've accepted and I don't condemn Dan if he never wants to come back - again. I've been pretty vocal about my feelings about dan's relationship with youtube and his audience and I don't make mystery of the fact that I don't think he loves youtube and that it's the right platform for him.

I don't think any of it is bad. These are my opinions of him. If he provides way to keep following him, I will. If he interacts with us, I will reply, because ultimately I feel a connection with him that goes beyond a 10 minutes pretentious video. But I can still appreciate him while calling him unprofessional for the way he's handled his end of the bargain, for completely withdrawing communication with us and not replying to the questions and the concerns that have poured in, and excuse me for thinking that he's aware of his own mistakes as well and that he was probably expecting the outpour of negative feelings that his tweet would create and that's why he followed it with the 2nd part (that I appreciated! because finally! acknowledgment!)

I just very much dislike the narrative that you can't say anything, in a fan space especially, for fear of what he would think if he happened to read it. I'm being critical of his job right now and the way he's handling it, and it shouldn't be confused with a critique on his person which we really don't know. Just like some people have way too harsh reactions when Dan does a mistake, and act like he's killed a puppy, some people have the same harsh reaction when someone express a negative feelings towards him. only opposite spectrum. That's a fact in this phandom that only got worse since Dan came out about his depression and that just makes it feel like some people use it as a cheap excuse to not be critical of a creator.

[anna_begins]

Dan could have much easier returned to social media if instead of vaguepranking he popped in with "sorry I've been absent, been having a tough time, [... Etc]". In fact, the most professional would have been to lead with that a few months ago.

Dan didn't actually leave social media though. Less active for sure, but not absent. In fact someone pointed out on twitter the other day that Dan has actually tweeted more than Phil this year if you don't count retweets & spon. He's also replied to more followers. He's been consistently liking art on tumblr. Dan's posted the same amount of pictures to instagram this year as Phil has and while ig stories have been few & far between he has still shared some this year. I'm not sure an explanation is needed before returning to something you've never left.

In regards to wanting a less vague answer or a more "professional" statement as to when he's planning on returning to youtube, based on what he's been telling us for months (mukbang video, tumblr answertime, liveshows) it's been pretty clear that he doesn't' know exactly when he'll be back. I think saying "when I'm ready" is as much as he can give right now without raising expectations for a certain timeframe. If you haven't heard him say that he's been having a 'tough time' figuring out a plan, next steps, etc. for his channel you haven't really been listening to him because he hasn't been shy or vague when it comes to talking about that. I'm always surprised when I hear a non casual fan claim that Dan hasn't been clear about what's been keeping him from uploading (to his solo channel) when he's explained his thought process/mental issues surrounding it so many times. I genuinely don't understand the narrative that he hasn't been communicating with us when it comes to his solo stuff because that is factually untrue.

[somethingsketchy]

Can someone tell me what this means?

[waveydnp]

no two people’s experience with depression is the same, y’all. just gonna throw that out there. oftentimes it has very little to do with one’s general status in life. rich and successful people can be jus as depressed as us peasants

[liola]

no two people’s experience with depression is the same, y’all. just gonna throw that out there. oftentimes it has very little to do with one’s general status in life. rich and successful people can be jus as depressed as us peasants

I didn't mean that, obviously. I just mean that I think if he was THAT low that he couldn't tweet one "not ready yet" he would be in the means to get the help needed (and has the support of a partner that would help him), but he did tweet relatable things regardless and just decide to ignore everything else so I doubt it's been 3 consecutive months.

It feels cheap to rule out any other explanation just because he has depression imo. In his own video he said he was scared people would take it as him excusing himself, and what do you know, a lot of people are doing it right now.

[glitterintheair]

But let's not fool ourselves. Some people are babying and coddling Dan - just like some people used to do it with Phil too. I very much dislike the narrative that he's been dealing with a depressive episode for 3 months and that's why we have to be gentle with him - as someone who is currently having an episode and struggling to focus at work, it makes me feel angry on his behalf. He's still capable of being a human and doing things and if he really was in such a low point that it lasted 3 consecutive months, he'd have the money, the means and the support system to do things about it. He's had his usual bounds of relatable tweets every 10 days in these 3 months, so clearly he had the strenght to type something. He could've used that strenght to say something before yesterday.

I agree with your whole post but I wanted to quote this part in particular because that's very true. There's so many posts on various platforms saying how Dan is clearly going through something difficult, how he's been having a breakdown, how he hasn't uploaded yet because he fears the phandom's reaction and like... either those people are all friends with Dan, or I don't understand how they can possibly know that. It's plausible that he went through a difficult time during these months, but we don't have the absolute certainty, you know? And yes, he said he needed time to think about what to do next with dinof in the Tumblr Q&A, but that doesn't explain why we stopped seeing his face for two months or why he and Phil have stopped existing in the same space and time, for example. Or why he said "new merch coming soon..and maybe even a video" in February just to never mention any of that again.
The truth here is that no one knows what's going on - no matter how much we feel we might, no matter the various speculations, assumptions, theories - at the end of the day, we don't know. And it's fine not knowing everything, but I also think that it's not so fine not knowing absolutely anything at all; I've still the same questions I had in January, actually even more.

Can someone tell me what this means?

Dan booked tickets to see the Avengers and it was really hard to get them - just like it was for the Avengers to beat the big villain Thanos.

[bevioletsky]

Hmm okay I’ll say this to clarify: I have absolutely no problem with someone calling Dan out on his unprofessionalism or anything else for that matter, and I know he’s never going to see any of this so sure, go off if you feel like it. But I also simply don’t agree with characterising his behaviour as emotionally manipulative and if I disagree with the, in my opinion, unwarranted amount of anger it shouldn’t be taken as an attempt to coddle him. I guess it can feel jarring to see a slew of posts in a tone you disagree with, and that clearly goes both ways. I just think he’s been pretty clear about not being ready to upload yet, on multiple occasions. He’s not asking people for anything at the moment, and just yesterday expressed gratitude for people still caring. You can of course also just not, anymore. I personally mainly feel empathy towards Dan, and like someone said earlier, don’t find it worth my time or energy to be angry at dnp. That’s me. Not trying to tell anyone else how to feel. But also disagreeing with what I feel like is a mischaracterisation.

I do get the boredom though, I started watching them by randomly clicking on a gaming video that was recommended to me, and the second type of content I watched was actually a Dan liveshow (this was when he uploaded them to his side channel with a title and all, so I didn’t know it was a liveshow when clicking on it). I was never into vloggers or YT personalities so I know for sure I wouldn’t be watching Phil’s main channel videos if I didn’t already like him as a person, and the same probably goes for Dan’s videos, tbh. So I’m not doing great for preferred content, either. Maybe it’s the fact that I don’t have a lot of experience in new media fandoms where expectation for continuous content is high combined with the fact that I don’t lose interest easily and don’t find myself actively joining and leaving fandoms, but I do have a fair amount of patience left. Also I do still think that both Dan and joint content will return in some capacity, at least for a period of time.

[plinthofmylife]

Changing gears, as we enter month 4 of this hiatus from content, I thought it might be fun to try a thought experiment. What do we think they do all day?

Dan and Phil are professional entertainers who aren't currently producing content (well, Phil's making 1 video every 10 days or so so we can subtract 2-3 hours from his schedule every 10 days) so the question remains, what do they do all day? Anyone want to hazard a guess?

Depending on what's in the pipeline which we don't know about, there may be lots of emails/skype calls regarding future projects, and also regarding future merch. Now they're not planning a tour/on tour/not doing gaming videos, I imagine their days are a lot less full than last years.

I did a forum post based on my own experience of being a full-time creator (with one tenth the followers that they have) with how long various tasks take me and what I expect their day to day looks like.

Here's the thing, I do think Dan could be handling this better. I hope he doesn't pull a charlieissocoolliike and just straight up disappear and then explain it in a tweet storm several years later. Charlie wasn't professionally connected to his life partner, nor founder of a merch company that other people's livelihood's relied on, though. (not to mention his professional partner/roommate became toxic to his career years ago.)

I don't know how much we are gaining by having this same conversation in a loop. I wish we were getting joint content. I wish Dan was communicating better. That being said, he has notoriously extra fans. There are very few people who have entire fandoms melt down when they don't tweet for 11 days. We have been conditioned to be regularly fed. Maybe it's time we start to stan from afar. I hope Dan realizes what his lack of communication is doing to his fanbase and that some won't come back.

[noodlebum]

Changing gears, as we enter month 4 of this hiatus from content, I thought it might be fun to try a thought experiment. What do we think they do all day?

Dan and Phil are professional entertainers who aren't currently producing content (well, Phil's making 1 video every 10 days or so so we can subtract 2-3 hours from his schedule every 10 days) so the question remains, what do they do all day? Anyone want to hazard a guess?

Depending on what's in the pipeline which we don't know about, there may be lots of emails/skype calls regarding future projects, and also regarding future merch. Now they're not planning a tour/on tour/not doing gaming videos, I imagine their days are a lot less full than last years.

I did a forum post based on my own experience of being a full-time creator (with one tenth the followers that they have) with how long various tasks take me and what I expect their day to day looks like.

That post is really interesting, thank you for linking it again

[plinthofmylife]

In other news, https://www.danandphilshop.com/ is "closed for site maintenance". Which perhaps means...phil's dropping new merch? They're closing the joint shop and killing it with all the jointness we hold dear?

[AltMay]

I did a forum post based on my own experience of being a full-time creator (with one tenth the followers that they have) with how long various tasks take me and what I expect their day to day looks like.

Here's the thing, I do think Dan could be handling this better. I hope he doesn't pull a charlieissocoolliike and just straight up disappear and then explain it in a tweet storm several years later. Charlie wasn't professionally connected to his life partner, nor founder of a merch company that other people's livelihood's relied on, though. (not to mention his professional partner/roommate became toxic to his career years ago.)

I don't know how much we are gaining by having this same conversation in a loop. I wish we were getting joint content. I wish Dan was communicating better. That being said, he has notoriously extra fans. There are very few people who have entire fandoms melt down when they don't tweet for 11 days. We have been conditioned to be regularly fed. Maybe it's time we start to stan from afar. I hope Dan realizes what his lack of communication is doing to his fanbase and that some won't come back.

Writing in English is not my forte so I'll try to get my point across as best as I can.
For a while I've been thinking maybe they're purposely aiming towards a smaller fanbase. I might be going off on a tangent but it makes sense to me that after all they've been through professionally and personally they might be trying to work with a smaller audience. But on the other hand, I think if this was the case, ghosting us and leaving us in the dark wouldn't be the ideal/professional way to do it. So that makes me doubt my own theory hahah
Idk, I don't feel one way or another, angry or protective, I tend to gravitate around a mix of emotions powered by the lack of joint content. That's what I miss the most and the one thing I never though we'd lose.

[knq]

Dan didn't actually leave social media though. Less active for sure, but not absent. In fact someone pointed out on twitter the other day that Dan has actually tweeted more than Phil this year if you don't count retweets & spon. He's also replied to more followers. He's been consistently liking art on tumblr. Dan's posted the same amount of pictures to instagram this year as Phil has and while ig stories have been few & far between he has still shared some this year. I'm not sure an explanation is needed before returning to something you've never left.

Did somebody ask... for a GRAPH? :DDDDD


(I was just going to link the graphs from socialbearing but they're on such different scales that they're misleading so this is my frankengraph.)

This surprised me considering I've thought of Dan as basically absent from twitter this year. It's worth pointing out that he's tweeted more than Phil in the year overall, but less than Phil after the viewing party in mid-January. Dan tweeted a lot during the viewing party.

You and @bevioletsky have both said what I want to say but haven't found the words for today. I just want to second the following opinions

I'm always surprised when I hear a non casual fan claim that Dan hasn't been clear about what's been keeping him from uploading (to his solo channel) when he's explained his thought process/mental issues surrounding it so many times. I genuinely don't understand the narrative that he hasn't been communicating with us when it comes to his solo stuff because that is factually untrue.

Hmm okay I’ll say this to clarify: I have absolutely no problem with someone calling Dan out on his unprofessionalism or anything else for that matter, and I know he’s never going to see any of this so sure, go off if you feel like it. But I also simply don’t agree with characterising his behaviour as emotionally manipulative and if I disagree with the, in my opinion, unwarranted amount of anger it shouldn’t be taken as an attempt to coddle him.

Less eloquently I'll add that I truly don't perceive Dan to be an "attention seeking drama queen" or for his behavior and interactions with the fanbase, sparse as it is recently, to be emotionally manipulative. I'm not excusing behavior I see as emotionally manipulative because he has depression and I want to coddle him: I just genuinely don't see it as emotionally manipulative in the first place.

[alittledizzy]

[Stakhanov]

Anyone can obviously voice any opinion they want about Dan. Or I would hope so, otherwise this isn't a forum but some kind of weird playground. But, if you are going to use harsh words like 'almost' gaslighting or claim he should do this or that or act this or that way, don't expect to be immune from criticism either. I sure get my fair part of that too, with the occasional mod dropping in to judge my style and content.

Anyway. I don't know why people act so negative towards Dan and every breath he takes. I think people are acting quite entitled when they say he's vague or that he shouldn't have made this joke. There's plenty of people who are just fine with his sense of humor and I think he has dropped a lot of hints starting from way before the official hiatus that he's not in a state or simply doesn't want to create content. His last video was more than a year ago and he talked the return of his channel way before december. He's not obliged to offer an explanation. He's not obliged to consider the sensitivities of everyone in the fandom or meet the wild expectations some people have. I'm glad he's not confirming to the ridiculous criticism that sometimes gets thrown at him, because maybe that way he'll regain some of his motivation and I will actually be able to watch some of his new content that's so far has always been free and entertaining to watch. On a lot of issues, the problem imo isn't with Dan, it's with his his crazy audience.

[Ataraxia25]

Hmm okay I’ll say this to clarify: I have absolutely no problem with someone calling Dan out on his unprofessionalism or anything else for that matter, and I know he’s never going to see any of this so sure, go off if you feel like it. But I also simply don’t agree with characterising his behaviour as emotionally manipulative and if I disagree with the, in my opinion, unwarranted amount of anger it shouldn’t be taken as an attempt to coddle him.

Less eloquently I'll add that I truly don't perceive Dan to be an "attention seeking drama queen" or for his behavior and interactions with the fanbase, sparse as it is recently, to be emotionally manipulative. I'm not excusing behavior I see as emotionally manipulative because he has depression and I want to coddle him: I just genuinely don't see it as emotionally manipulative in the first place.

These quotes sump up really well what I think on the matter! I call Dan out all the time, I call out how he does (not) interact with us and such but I just had a problem with the phrasing of the original post and I don't think that means I baby or coddle him

[Ataraxia25]

Anyone can obviously voice any opinion they want about Dan. Or I would hope so, otherwise this isn't a forum but some kind of weird playground. But, if you are going to use harsh words like 'almost' gaslighting or claim he should do this or that or act this or that way, don't expect to be immune from criticism either. I sure get my fair part of that too, with the occasional mod dropping in to judge my style and content.

Anyway. I don't know why people act so negative towards Dan and every breath he takes. I think people are acting quite entitled when they say he's vague or that he shouldn't have made this joke. There's plenty of people who are just fine with his sense of humor and I think he has dropped a lot of hints starting from way before the official hiatus that he's not in a state or simply doesn't want to create content. His last video was more than a year ago and he talked the return of his channel way before december. He's not obliged to offer an explanation. He's not obliged to consider the sensitivities of everyone in the fandom or meet the wild expectations some people have. I'm glad he's not confirming to the ridiculous criticism that sometimes gets thrown at him, because maybe that way he'll regain some of his motivation and I will actually be able to watch some of his new content that's so far has always been free and entertaining to watch. On a lot of issues, the problem imo isn't with Dan, it's with his his crazy audience.

1) Because his attitude can be frustrating for some. I am very frustrated with him sometimes or sometimes I have too much on my mind to dwell on it. We are, all of us, an audience and we do not have the same expectations (and of course we are expecting things from him right now, we are literally in a waiting state) so I guess that's why you don't understand. But good for you.

2) I don't think the problem is the crazy audience. I, for one, don't think I'm crazy just because I'm tired of this in-between phase. Waiting is hard and it's even harder when you do not know what you're waiting for.

[plinthofmylife]

@knq I love that you heard a graph batsignal and came running

[madzilla84]

Looks like the D&P shop is back up but they’ve added even more items to the sale. I wish they’d added the hoodies before I ordered!

[fancybum]

The issue isn’t Dan’s main channel- yes he’s factually been pretty clear about not planning on posting weekly or anything like that ever (but also, as someone mentioned earlier, saying in FEBRUARY after already being awol for a month on all channels that ~maybe there’d be a video at some point and then going right back into hiding is, imo, factually fucking annoying. That combined with him only popping up again right before they hocked some merch is....side-eye worthy), the issue is him disappearing completely and never bracing us for that. No dinof? No prob! There’s still dapg! Oh, no dapg? Right, okay, well, liveshows...? Semi-regular contact on social media...? (2 days of aliveness doesn’t retroactively cover the past 3 months). Maybe pop up in Phil vids....? No explanation (or warning) for any of those last few is what I’m personally pissed about, and considering how unenthusiastic a lot of people here seem about dinof vids (or Dan himself without Phil there as a buffer), it seems that’s what most people are upset/frustrated with. Deflecting that frustration with “he’s actually been pretty clear about not posting on his main channel lols, what’s the problem?” is garbage.

[noodlebum]

Looks like the D&P shop is back up but they’ve added even more items to the sale. I wish they’d added the hoodies before I ordered!

Ooh now that purple hoodie is very tempting!

[madzilla84]

Looks like the D&P shop is back up but they’ve added even more items to the sale. I wish they’d added the hoodies before I ordered!

Ooh now that purple hoodie is very tempting!

Definitely! Enough so that I might just suck up the second shipping charge.

Not gonna lie though, I can’t help but find this huge sale a bit ominous...