Dan & Phil Part 86: here, queer & full of existential fear

[ravenreyes]

i've just been thinking about how things are going to be going forward, i don't really know what to expect bc i never expected the past week to happen in the first place.
and while a part of me wants something like the mukbang video or for dapg to come back (please), i wouldn't blame them if they'd want to mostly just chill before vidcon bc that's probably going to be a lot.

also while i don't really think how they interact on camera or in public is going to change or anything, just having it all out there in the open has to be a relief. now that people know that neither of them are straight and that they have been/are in a relationship and not have to worry about being outed or people finding out before they were ready to say anything.
and not that it matters, but i am also curious though about who knew about them through them. vs like second hand or assuming.


idk, maybe i'm projecting. i just still can't stop thinking about everything that's happened since dan posted the video lmao.
also i constantly just want to hug them

A mukbang is honestly all I want right now. I want it more than a liveshow for sure. Liveshows are nervous for them. I want to hear them discuss this in a comfortable environment for them.

oh yeah, for sure. a liveshow right now would probably be too much. even though i like watching liveshows sometimes i always find them kind of awkward and right now it would probably be even worse.
a mukbang where they can just talk to each other about whatever they want + not having to think about it being live to thousands of people sounds much better to me. and god same, it's all i want right now.

Double post sorry - but I wanted to mention that Youtube Space New York had a pride party this week and they played videos by queer creators and "Basically I'm Gay" was included and my

aw that's so nice

[noodlebum]

A mukbang would be so good. Maybe a vegan one, if that's what Dan tries to eat most of the time. I don't really care what they eat though tbh. Can't wait til October for the next possible one

[Artdefines06]

Hello all! I havent had time to read all the pages but I'm going to drop some random thoughts here and probably run away. My one year old does not tolerate internet forum reading sorry.

First Im super happy for dan that he finally got this all off his chest. I remember when living my truth came out I had a pretty big concern for him because he clearly wasn't really living his truth and was still struggling and from a "married woman studying psych to be a counselor who has watched a lot of her close friends make giant mistakes" POV the boy clearly was still not in a good place. I hope this helps and he can really get there.

However, that were still things that read strangely to me and since I have been right in my heart before I wonder...

Much like Dan and god, these are all just thoughts and I dont really hardcore believe any of them but I need to get them out of my head. Who am I to really know anything I'm just a humble thinker.

The "being super horney all the time" and "cute mutuals slide into my dm's" stuff really stuck an odd note with me. There are only two options I can see. 1) He wants to be more open about physically loving phil 2)He wants to explore relationships with people other than phil and couldn't do it without coming out. Lets explore these.

I'm going to preface both of these with a little about my marriage. ( I'm bi and my husband is very straight but also metro and girly so while we are technically hetro I feel safe making a few connections to a gay relationship because love is love damn it and I have seen all the same stupidness in all relationships.) I have generalized anxiety and my hubby has high social anxiety and we are both major introverts. We are soulmates who have been together over 15 years, married for seven, and boy did we mess things up multiple times and will continue to do so. Relationships are not easy no matter how compatible and no one is 100% compatible.

1) Phil - soulmate, first real BF, cutie patootie phil. We all know Dan can barely contain himself when it comes to complimenting and defending and reaching out to touch. maybe hes finally frustrated with what I believe were self imposed rules and wants to be the overbearing overloving BF he probably could be. Maybe he wants to hold hands in the airport because he's bored of having panic attacks over someone seeing them and it calm him. Maybe he just doesnt care anymore and heally wants to stop the speculation over hotel rooms and bunks so he can have a night of cuddling in peace without nagging fear in the back of his head that people might find out.

Dan made a really sweet comment about being free to screw it all up in peace and I really loved that because it is so true but guess what he already has been. We know they were together and we saw the strain on their relationship in 2012 and we don't truly know about now but if they have been together than Phil is the biggest saint any of us have ever seen to put up with being closeted this long. Its not been healthy for him either to be closeted this long. It means he isnt really living his truth either and while he does have a much more "at peace" approach to it the denial is still there and strong and a problem in the long run. If they are together he is still half the decision-making process for things like "how do we tell people we almost bought a house together?, oh we dont we say you almost bought one and leave me out of it." That stuff is damaging esp to someone like Dan who has high anxiety about everything.

2) They are not together and dan wants to try new things so to speak. OOOOh boy is there a lot to unpack here. Its not unheard of and not even unfair. I have seen so many good relationships break up over bad decisions or small miscommunications or just plain stubbornness or existential fear. Maybe he worries he is overly reliant of phil and needs to detach a little to see if he can stand on his own. Maybe, like I said before, they are not 100% compatible and dan wonders if there is someone out there who he can be 100% with. There isn't, its not possible, but like he said he needs to find out on his own and screw up his own way to learn that. My fav has always been ace-spectrum phil but thats a level of speculating we are not really supposed to do so I will leave it alone.

As usual, what dan wants is pretty heart on his sleeve but wtf is Phil really thinking 2k19 pls.

[alittledizzy]

Hello all! I havent had time to read all the pages but I'm going to drop some random thoughts here and probably run away. My one year old does not tolerate internet forum reading sorry.

First Im super happy for dan that he finally got this all off his chest. I remember when living my truth came out I had a pretty big concern for him because he clearly wasn't really living his truth and was still struggling and from a "married woman studying psych to be a counselor who has watched a lot of her close friends make giant mistakes" POV the boy clearly was still not in a good place. I hope this helps and he can really get there.

However, that were still things that read strangely to me and since I have been right in my heart before I wonder...

Much like Dan and god, these are all just thoughts and I dont really hardcore believe any of them but I need to get them out of my head. Who am I to really know anything I'm just a humble thinker.

The "being super horney all the time" and "cute mutuals slide into my dm's" stuff really stuck an odd note with me. There are only two options I can see. 1) He wants to be more open about physically loving phil 2)He wants to explore relationships with people other than phil and couldn't do it without coming out. Lets explore these.

I'm going to preface both of these with a little about my marriage. ( I'm bi and my husband is very straight but also metro and girly so while we are technically hetro I feel safe making a few connections to a gay relationship because love is love damn it and I have seen all the same stupidness in all relationships.) I have generalized anxiety and my hubby has high social anxiety and we are both major introverts. We are soulmates who have been together over 15 years, married for seven, and boy did we mess things up multiple times and will continue to do so. Relationships are not easy no matter how compatible and no one is 100% compatible.

1) Phil - soulmate, first real BF, cutie patootie phil. We all know Dan can barely contain himself when it comes to complimenting and defending and reaching out to touch. maybe hes finally frustrated with what I believe were self imposed rules and wants to be the overbearing overloving BF he probably could be. Maybe he wants to hold hands in the airport because he's bored of having panic attacks over someone seeing them and it calm him. Maybe he just doesnt care anymore and heally wants to stop the speculation over hotel rooms and bunks so he can have a night of cuddling in peace without nagging fear in the back of his head that people might find out.

Dan made a really sweet comment about being free to screw it all up in peace and I really loved that because it is so true but guess what he already has been. We know they were together and we saw the strain on their relationship in 2012 and we don't truly know about now but if they have been together than Phil is the biggest saint any of us have ever seen to put up with being closeted this long. Its not been healthy for him either to be closeted this long. It means he isnt really living his truth either and while he does have a much more "at peace" approach to it the denial is still there and strong and a problem in the long run. If they are together he is still half the decision-making process for things like "how do we tell people we almost bought a house together?, oh we dont we say you almost bought one and leave me out of it." That stuff is damaging esp to someone like Dan who has high anxiety about everything.

2) They are not together and dan wants to try new things so to speak. OOOOh boy is there a lot to unpack here. Its not unheard of and not even unfair. I have seen so many good relationships break up over bad decisions or small miscommunications or just plain stubbornness or existential fear. Maybe he worries he is overly reliant of phil and needs to detach a little to see if he can stand on his own. Maybe, like I said before, they are not 100% compatible and dan wonders if there is someone out there who he can be 100% with. There isn't, its not possible, but like he said he needs to find out on his own and screw up his own way to learn that. My fav has always been ace-spectrum phil but thats a level of speculating we are not really supposed to do so I will leave it alone.

As usual, what dan wants is pretty heart on his sleeve but wtf is Phil really thinking 2k19 pls.

(Just sticking part of it under a spoiler for length!)

I really think that focusing on the jokes about availability is doing a disservice to the actual serious tone of his comments about Phil and their life together ("companions through life") and how what they have is theirs and personal and how he wants to keep the details of his personal life private (and so does Phil). Personally, I can't see any interpretation of that video that leaves them not together. It's genuinely floored me that people watched that and walked away not comprehending the gravity of soulmates, real best friends, companions through life, more than just romantic. To me, he was in no way vague on that. If he didn't want it to be obvious that they are together now, he wouldn't have had to disclaim that he knows people want to know more but he and Phil are both private people who want to keep the details of their personal life private. It was a statement that could have stood alone for himself if in the present day his personal, private life didn't also include Phil.

But I do know people focus on jokes about sex because the hyperfocus on who he is fucking is something people are invested in but I also think everyone can really agree that Dan is someone who appreciates attention. I think it must feel good for him to be able to joke about the kind of attention he likes, but jokes =/= serious intent. This fandom has trust issues and immediately doubts anything that seems obvious even in the case of Dan being crystal clear about the situation around his past obfuscation of what was, in his own words 'obviously' true ('obviously, we were more than friends'). But I hope that watching them live their life over the coming months and years reassures and makes people realize that it's okay to just accept that two queer people are partners in every way and that thirst jokes - especially from someone like Dan who will likely never stop making jokes, and someone like Phil who is absolutely unphased by them and not threatened at all - don't undercut a relationship and aren't a reason to doubt the kind of love that Dan expressed about Phil in that video.

[Amiaw]

I still have some conflicting thoughts about dnp but I do think that Dan very seriously saying that he was private and didn’t want to talk about his sex life should be given more weight than the joking comments about his thirst.
The only comment that really threw me in the video was him talking about how coming out would let the world know what kind of attention he wanted.

[PolarFox]

Someone wise once said on this forum, that proving “phan is real” would require at least 6 sex tapes and/or wedding photos. And despite having a word for it from our cult leader Daniel, that statement still seems to ring true

[greenergrass]

+1 to everything in @alittledizzy post

and look idgaf about their sex life. they could be fucking anyone they want (together or separate). I personally don't think they do that based on different reasons, but hey they can do whatever they want sex-wise to spice things up or explore or whatever they want.

What is clear though is that they are together. Romantically and otherwise, together through life. Dan literally said that. And we can't know what will happen in the future obviously, but I don't personally really think dan could have made things more clear

[fancybum]

Dan made a really sweet comment about being free to screw it all up in peace and I really loved that because it is so true but guess what he already has been. We know they were together and we saw the strain on their relationship in 2012 and we don't truly know about now but if they have been together than Phil is the biggest saint any of us have ever seen to put up with being closeted this long. Its not been healthy for him either to be closeted this long. It means he isnt really living his truth either and while he does have a much more "at peace" approach to it the denial is still there and strong and a problem in the long run. If they are together he is still half the decision-making process for things like "how do we tell people we almost bought a house together?, oh we dont we say you almost bought one and leave me out of it." That stuff is damaging esp to someone like Dan who has high anxiety about everything.

I've been trying to stay away from everything but wow, I'm sorry, I think these are really disgusting things to say about somebody you don't really know anything about (but also just generally). You have Dan's story and struggle with all of this, but I don't think it follows to just automatically extrapolate it to Phil's exact experience as well. How is not explicitly telling the world specific details about his own private life mean he's in denial and unhealthy? Who even are you to decide he's considered himself ~closeted this entire time without him saying that? And even worse insinuating it's been Dan's "fault"? He's a saint for putting up with Dan's issues? Like what the actual fuck is this entire statement?

[madzilla84]

^ Re. a couple of posts up, that's kind of where I'm at, too. I was thrown by his comments about his thirst and the sexual attention he wanted; I partly thought maybe it's just 'Dan's Gonna Dan' but then again it does jive oddly with his comments about Phil. (Though if I were one of those cute mutuals, his description of Phil might make me feel like I was stepping on toes, I dunno.) I felt like his request for privacy and refusal to provide details could refer to what they'd had at *any* point, be that solely in the past or ongoing to this day. I honestly don't know if I believe they're still together or not; I want to, and I totally could believe it, like I don't think it's a reach at all. I envy people who can believe wholeheartedly and wish my brain wasn't so insistent on slapping a huge 'BUT WHAT IF' sticker on everything.

But I hope that watching them live their life over the coming months and years reassures [...]

I think this'll be what'll be the decider for me. I guess we'll just have to wait and see; I know there are a bunch of things they won't share either way (and quite rightly), but things like whether the oft-mentioned 'forever home' does or doesn't happen, or if they see other people, would say a lot to me.

*pins up 'i want to believe' poster*

[onomatopoeia]

Hi guys. Haven't posted on here much but after Dan's video I just had so much to say, so I thought I'd come up here and share. It's basically just going to be an reiteration of what everyone has said already though lol!

Because timezones suck, I was asleep when Dan tweeted his first tweet and when he posted the video, so I missed the initial hype, but I somehow woke up at 5 in the morning and decided to check my phone. The first tweet I saw was Phil's, and I was like did I accidentally turn on notifs for a random phan account? "My sexuality" are not words that I ever thought I would see on an Amazingphil account. Then I scrolled down and saw that Dan actually posted a video named "Basically I'm gay" and I just started crying lmao.

I've been in the phandom since 2012/2013, and I remember so clearly the period of time when I first got into them, and spent all those days watching every single video there is on the internet, then finding the phandirectory and trying to crack the password I also remember being really confused because I was so sure that they were together in 2009/2010, but at the time, 2012!Dan kept insisting that he was straight. I was pretty young and didn't really understand why people were closeted, but then as time went on, they opened up more and more, especially in the post baking universe until last year. I stopped having doubts along the way and just started enjoying all the cute moments we got. And like many other people, I honestly didn't think Dan would ever make a video like this. I thought they would just one day get a house and get a dog and just live their lives without ever coming out but making it very obvious. However, I'm super happy to be proven wrong and that we were graced with this amazing masterpiece.

I just can't describe how tremendously happy and proud I am of him these past few days. I'm so glad he finally got this huge burden off his chest and can really be his true self. To see him change from actively denying his sexuality in 2012 to finally feeling ready to tell the whole world is so, so heartwarming.

They've really played a big part in my life regarding sexuality and accepting myself for whoever I am, and I hope they truly recognize how many lives they've changed, and how much courage and joy they've given people these past few years. I'm just extremely excited for whatever is going to come in the future, but for now, I'm going to go rewatch more "hits differents" and weep byeee

p.s. the courage Dan must've had to go on Google and search for his old tweets and formspring answers. my god.

[scientia]

RE: DMs, I think a perfectly reasonable take away from the video is based on Dan’s actual words. He is gay, was at some point romantically involved with Phil, wants to keep his relationship(s) private, but also invited DMs. I don’t think speculation about that last point minimizes anything - Dan went out of his way to say that, fully knowing what the likely reaction would be.

Someone who didn’t know anything about DnP would be absolutely justified in thinking Dan is open to seeing other people, whether or not he’s currently in a relationship with Phil.

[alittledizzy]

RE: DMs, I think a perfectly reasonable take away from the video is based on Dan’s actual words. He is gay, was at some point romantically involved with Phil, wants to keep his relationship(s) private, but also invited DMs. I don’t think speculation about that last point minimizes anything - Dan went out of his way to say that, fully knowing what the likely reaction would be.

Someone who didn’t know anything about DnP would be absolutely justified in thinking Dan is open to seeing other people, whether or not he’s currently in a relationship with Phil.

I disagree based on the context of their life together, I think it's alright to look at the big picture of what he's saying and combine that with his words.

I also think that at this point I'd rather just celebrate what they have together, the support, the life they share, and the fact that they just took that step together rather than have the 'is phan real' argument immediately be 'is phan real now' and get wrapped up in that debate - which I'm saying while acknowledging I voluntarily responded above, so this isn't a direct response to anyone, just me reminding myself that I'm just like... too damn happy and proud of Dan/them to want to lose myself in different interpretations of his words when they make me feel frustrated or hopeless.

(But this is a forum literally for debate and conversation so I'm not saying the conversation shouldn't be happening. This is exactly the place for it.)

[noodlebum]

(Though if I were one of those cute mutuals, his description of Phil might make me feel like I was stepping on toes, I dunno.)

Having a few days now to think about it all, this is something that makes me believe they're still together. I mean, who would dare try anything with Dan when his entire youtube career and personal life is wrapped up with another man he definitely dated at some point, even if it's not now? And like madzilla said, with his description of Phil too?
Aside from Dan's thirsty jokes which I admit also threw me, I wouldn't be trying to slip any dm's when this guy Phil is still obviously around. If they aren't together still, then that's extremely intimidating for anyone who is trying to 'slide into his dm's', with Dan still living with his soul mate who he does everything with

[snoopysadie]

Hoi.

It just occurred to me that there must be a pile of deleted-for-gayness outtakes and bloopers somewhere.

I demand.

OMG imagine that, 'DanAndPhilGames Bloopers: Gay edition'

News flash: this is the type of thought that will consume me. They are SO GAY on camera already. Imagine more gayness. It would be almost pinof1 cuts. Holy shit.
Never sleeping again

[glitterintheair]

I must say, I hope I find an ex I can live in three different apartments with after breaking up, while still working together, going on vacation together, going on double dates together - but as exes ofc, spending the days leading up to Christmas with their family and planning on adopt a corgi or possibly an ugly mongrel together. Oh, and referring to them as my companion through life and actual soulmate.. actually, you know what? That sounds too complicated, I'd rather stay single.

[Amiaw]

Dan did talk about wanting to be accepted by the community so having his mutuals slide into his dm’s could also mean he wants conversation and support.

[annetamiau]

To add to the current discussion, I wholeheartedly believe Dan and Phil are together now (what applied before the video (life so intertwined they are about to become one single formless blob) still applies now). I too can't seem to understand how people can come to the conclusion that Dan is single after the video.

What has really changed (in my eyes) is that I used to think they were monogamous based on small details (like 'Who's Alyssa' or Dan's reaction to Phil including a threesome in that game he designed as a teenager - I know I was grasping at straws but it was the general vibe too). After the video, I think they are in an open relationship. It wasn't the thirst comments alone that sealed it for me, but the fact that Dan didn't give the impression of having only been with Phil since the end of 2009. Open relationships are very common for gay couples, especially really long-term ones. I know their love story is still like the best romance ever, and that a couple doesn't have to be monogamous for their love to be genuine, but it must be something ingrained in me that makes me not feel it the same, so while I'm very happy with how things have turned out for Dan and Phil, there's something bittersweet for me too. I'm aware this is totally me projecting my personal views on them and I shouldn't do that, and I know this is just speculation and I could be totally wrong, but that's what I think as of now.

(Also hi, I haven't posted in like 2 or 3 years).

[alittledizzy]

but the fact that Dan didn't give the impression of having only been with Phil since the end of 2009.

I do disagree with you strongly, but I'm curious to know why you believe this? Dan didn't say anything about his personal or romantic past 2009 aside from talking briefly about his relationship with Phil in 2011 ("ours and personal") and I've watched that video enough times to practically have it memorized.

In fact, the only explicit reference to sex he really made at all aside from things that are just as valid within a relationship (as in, that he has sex) was phrased as being immediately before Phil.

[George]

I wouldn't be trying to slip any dm's when this guy Phil is still obviously around.

An angry Phil dm has a whole new meaning

[noodlebum]

I wouldn't be trying to slip any dm's when this guy Phil is still obviously around.

An angry Phil dm has a whole new meaning

I know right, watch out lads, Philly's about

[liola]

I mean just because you like attention from cute mutuals doesn't mean you're also not in a committed relationship? It's not like he said "and now I'm ready to fuck anyone who comes near yas let's have sex"

He didn't talk at all about any other relationship that didn't involve Phil. Also I kinda find irk this idea that open relationships are all the rage in gay couples, I know it's kinda common especially in LA but like.. it kinda perpetrates, imo, the idea that gay couples cannot commit to serious dating. I don't think anyone is trying to imply that and I do know that polyamory is different than just not wanting to commit, but this idea that they HAVE to be open.. would you say the same to a straight couple that has been together 10+ years?

[annetamiau]

but the fact that Dan didn't give the impression of having only been with Phil since the end of 2009.

I do disagree with you strongly, but I'm curious to know why you believe this? Dan didn't say anything about his personal or romantic past 2009 aside from talking briefly about his relationship with Phil in 2011 ("ours and personal") and I've watched that video enough times to practically have it memorized.

In fact, the only explicit reference to sex he really made at all aside from things that are just as valid within a relationship (as in, that he has sex) was phrased as being immediately before Phil.

I have to admit there wasn't a single point that I remember, and I have only watched the video once. It was the general impression I got and I could very well be completely wrong. However, I do think Dan and Phil are together, and monogamous or not their relationship is like out of a film.

Also I wasn't trying to say gay couples can't commit to serious dating, I was just quoting my dad who has been in a gay relationship for 10+ years and whose friends are mostly also long term gay couples (we live in the south of Europe).

[Ataraxia25]

Hard agreed with @glitterintheair and @liola's posts.

[snokoplasmic]

Dan made a really sweet comment about being free to screw it all up in peace and I really loved that because it is so true but guess what he already has been. We know they were together and we saw the strain on their relationship in 2012 and we don't truly know about now but if they have been together than Phil is the biggest saint any of us have ever seen to put up with being closeted this long. Its not been healthy for him either to be closeted this long. It means he isnt really living his truth either and while he does have a much more "at peace" approach to it the denial is still there and strong and a problem in the long run. If they are together he is still half the decision-making process for things like "how do we tell people we almost bought a house together?, oh we dont we say you almost bought one and leave me out of it." That stuff is damaging esp to someone like Dan who has high anxiety about everything.

I've been trying to stay away from everything but wow, I'm sorry, I think these are really disgusting things to say about somebody you don't really know anything about (but also just generally)[...]

Yeah, I've got to say, this is an incredibly fucked up statement to make. The insinuation that LGBT people are hiding or holding themselves back in life by not being out is one of the most frustrating and disgusting hot takes people seem to have these days. Like sorry that they had personal reasons for not disclosing their relationship and/or sexualities (which, by the way, Dan explains in his video. They wanted to keep it a secret just for themselves), and sorry that you don't seem to realize that many times people have their own reason for being in the closet, and it's not always bad or a burden for them. I'm also sorry that you feel entitled enough to consider yourself qualified to explain to the rest of us their innermost feelings on these things during what was a very stressful point in their lives. Blaming Dan solely for them being in the closet and straight up saying that Phil had to "put up" with him is such an offensive insinuation -- that they are not equals in their relationship, that Dan is holding Phil back (which is a common critique of both mentally ill and closeted people, so that one doubly rubs me the wrong way), that they didn't decide together what would be best for the two of them. I don't wanna sound like I'm attacking you personally, because that's not what I'm trying to do, but there seems to be lots of reaching assumptions about both of their personalities/thoughts/actions in this post, disguised under the pretense of being happy for them.

[rizzo]

Did y'all... like..... watch the video? Or any of Dan's videos... ever?

Not to get all spicy on IDB, but Dan made a single Dan-esque joke and folks are taking it at face value and ignoring every serious thing he said about Phil being his life companion and soulmate???

Dan has done nothing over the last handful of years but convey that he craves the D from a myriad of males. I could write a CVS-receipt-length list of moments (Troye Sivan, Evan Peters, that entire exchange between him and Phil about shirtless KJ Apa on insta) and y'all didn't blink an eyelash until he finally told you he's with Phil for life. And now suddenly, we're taking a comment about DMs from cute mutuals seriously?

And if that doesn't do it for you. There's also a slew of evidence in favor of Dan being a bit jealous, protective, and frankly, possessive over Phil. The last thing I envision Dan being okay with is an open relationship.

Like. Look. Everyone's opinion is perfectly valid, that's fine, and yes, sure, we've been conditioned to question everything these guys give to us. But look! Literally look!! At! This! Video! You don't even need to wear the phan goggles. He's literally TELLING YOU Phil is his soulmate and companion through life. That him and Phil prefer to keep their personal life private. That what he and Phil have is theirs and not ours. Like... I just don't understand how all of that gets overridden by a joke.

It's silly to me. This is all silly. I'll be over here on moving mountain (yes, mountain) waiting for the forever home to pop up any time now. And the mongrel they adopt. And also just every interaction we're going to get from now on.

I'm not about to ruin an incredible video and moment for Dan over..... a joke.