Dan & Phil Part 91: A Decade of Deppy

[actualsoulmates]

Imposter syndrome is the worst. I felt this one very deeply.

[Becky.rigby]

Oh Dan :/ he really isnt coping well by his tweets lately and his silence beforehand. I am actually really worried about him, I hope he is getting the support he needs and I admit I was a bit harsh with my post earlier but I was so annoyed as no matter how much i keep lying to myself saying i can move on and stop watching him, i do in fact miss him so much, and that is why I am still here and posting on here.

[knq]

I know Dan is sad tweeting rather than exploring the phenomenon of imposterism, but I can't help being curious what "important" might mean in that context. I've always seen imposter syndrome described in terms of a person's achievements, skill, or capability, usually at a job, and the belief that they're not actually as good as people think they are.

How does feeling important work into that. Important in terms of your impact on the world? Important in terms of celebrity/popularity?

Why am I thinking about this so hard?

[blahblahblah8]

I know Dan is sad tweeting rather than exploring the phenomenon of imposterism, but I can't help being curious what "important" might mean in that context. I've always seen imposter syndrome described in terms of a person's achievements, skill, or capability, usually at a job, and the belief that they're not actually as good as people think they are.

How does feeling important work into that. Important in terms of your impact on the world? Important in terms of celebrity/popularity?

Why am I thinking about this so hard?

I was thinking the same thing! I feel like I’ve had imposters syndrome for a while and it never related to feeling important. His tweet really confused me at first but I guess maybe he means he doesn’t feel like his role has qualifications so he doesn’t know why he has imposters syndrome? Idk...but I hope he’s okay and just tweeting some thoughts and reflections. I kinda feel like he wouldn’t be tweeting it if he was currently struggling through it so I hope he’s feeling better now.

[Megancita75]

I think I know what he means (i also think this is a bit of a jokey tweet). So for me this is a feeling I've gotten when I'm feeling like there is so little of worth that I have that even thinking I have enough skills or abilities to feel a fraud or imposter about them is a stretch. It's like the prerequisite for imposter syndrome is at least feeling you have some type of skills or value that is of some worth, so Dan's tweet is saying that's a bar too high sometimes.

[alittledizzy]

This strikes hard as a 'joking-not-joking' tweet for me. I don't think it's a stretch at all to think Dan has some imposter syndrome, he's a creator who barely creates and that has to play hard on his psyche at points. Whether it's depression, trauma he's had to process and deal with, or other things happening in his life - it's clear that things that might come easy for some youtubers (even Phil) don't come easy for him. He's got a lot of demons running around in his head and sometimes those slip out on twitter... especially when he's suffered recent disappointments (whatever project he couldn't get done when he wanted?) and late at night (which it is now).

[lovestillaround]

His tweet really confused me at first but I guess maybe he means he doesn’t feel like his role has qualifications so he doesn’t know why he has imposters syndrome?

Yeah, I think the same. I guess that they way people experience imposter syndrome can differ quite dramatically but I interpret his words as him saying that he doesn't feel like he deserves to have the imposter syndrome because he isn't actually successful at anything? So I might be him being vague and wishy-washy with words and just making a shortcut of his thoughts instead of offerring a more in-depth explanation of what's on in his mind.

Maybe it's just me being weird but the longer I think about it, the more I'm convinced that he used the word "important" on purpose, because using the word "successful" would mean that he acknowledges that he is in some way a successful person, and he doesn't feel like he is.

[itasca00]

As usual, this was a lovely liveshow! This week, my favorite part was the gaming segment because I got a huge amount of enjoyment watching Phil control a character that looked very much like his own little copy of Dan and try very hard to keep him safe. Here are my highlights:

• [2:16] For the celebration of Bonfire Night in the UK, an effigy of Guy Fawkes is traditionally burned in a bonfire. Apparently, when Phil was a kid, the effigy made by his parents was made out of Phil’s old school uniforms that no longer fit him. At the time, Phil liked that his school uniforms were being burned, but he finds it slightly disturbing in hindsight.
• [4:16] For Christmas, Phil isn’t sure if he’s going to get a real tree again because he’s been v disappointed that they haven’t been delivered by a person in a kilt (as advertised) the past two years.
• [5:35] NEWS STORY OF THE WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK: In Louisiana, a lady working in a doctor’s office was arrested because she had been selling doctor’s notes to high school students to get them out of their classes.
• [9:13] Phil says he used to have a pogo stick as a child, and it was loud and squeaky. When he was playing with it once, an angry neighbor shouted at him, “Shut the f up with that bouncin’ stick!” Phil says his parents responded, “Uh, it’s a free road. He can stick about, bouncin’ on his stick if he wants.” However, Phil decided to stop using his pogo stick anyway. At the end of his story, Phil is tickled that he said, “bouncin’ on his stick.”
• [14:41] Phil does a lovely imitation of some ASMR of eating noises.
• [14:56] Phil reacts to the recent news from My Chemical Romance. He isn’t sure if they’re coming back and doing “the whole shebang” or if they’re just doing one concert. If they’re doing the whole shebang, he says he’s going to start peeing. Later this leads to these fine statements:

  P: More people are saying “whole shebang” in the chat, so I’m getting excited now. The pee...is--I’m gonna stop with that sentence. That was--*laughs* I did say I’d start peeing. I’m not peeing. It’s fine.

  At [31:00], Phil says he’s not going to go to the concert.
• [17:51] Phil talks about going to Kew Gardens. He was surprised at how big it was. He ended up walking 16,000 steps, and he thinks this may be a personal best. Because of his sedentary job, he says he usually only gets in about 1,800 steps per day.
• [20:34] Phil says (not for the first time) that his favorite game on Nintendo Switch is Hollow Knight.
• [21:17] Phil shows us Norman Cam, and it is preceded by a cute spelling cheer of Norman’s name. At [22:26], Phil shows us Shrimp Cam. Phil calls the shrimp Dad Shrimp, Mum Shrimp, Baby Shrimp, and Peach Shrimp because Baby Shrimp is the child of Dad Shrimp and Mum Shrimp, and Peach Shrimp is a different color than the other three. Also, Phil still isn’t over how long snails live.
• [23:36] Phil talks about his latest video "I Try To Spend The Night In A Haunted Hotel - Ad".
• [28:28] Phil talks about Dan’s new merch! Phil thinks the candle is very Dan because it’s all black, and, much like his own candle, he thinks the Dandle smells very much like the essence of Dan (musky but in a good way, like spices, woody).
• [30:51] Someone in chat says that Dan’s Halloween Twitter layout outspooked Phil’s, and Phil reluctantly agrees.
• [31:07] Phil talks about the Phantom Frappuccino Halloween specialty drink from Starbucks that he previously highlighted in this Instagram Story. He eventually says ([31:54]):

  P: Apparently, it makes your poop black as well, so I think some people were drinking it like, “Um...am I okay?” I didn’t finish mine, so I don’t know if that phenomenon would happen to me.

  In case you’re starting to sense a theme (as I am), this is indeed at least the third time Phil has mentioned poop since he started doing liveshows again.
• [33:13] Phil hasn’t yet fully committed to his brown hair. He thinks he’s going to keep it brown for a bit, but he also still likes having black hair. He wanted to stop dying it for a bit just to see what it was like.
• [34:17] For the gaming segment this week, Phil plays Limbo. At [35:36], Phil agrees with someone in the chat’s assessment that the main character in the game looks like Dan. But at [40:56], Phil names the character Larry and not Dan because the character dies frequently in the game. My only other highlight from this segment is Phil saying after landing a difficult jump ([44:12]):

  P: Fully clenched my butt then.

[dogsaremybestfriends]

[*][34:17] For the gaming segment this week, Phil plays Limbo. At [35:36], Phil agrees with someone in the chat’s assessment that the main character in the game looks like Dan. But at [40:56], Phil names the character Larry and not Dan because the character dies frequently in the game.
[/list]

I know it's a little thing, but I found that bit genuinely quite sweet. Although I did also laugh at the thought of him naming the character Dan, and then playing the game and watching it be subjected to all these horrors.

[kavat]

The liveshow was so lovely. He has really found his groove with this new format, what felt stilted and weird at first now feels natural and comfortable. His support for Dan was really sweet and I liked seeing him solve some puzzles in the game.

Re: Dan's tweet: I have a theory in the back of my head that his next project is more related to mainstream media in some form (maybe not book but perhaps tv or radio related) and this tweet fits right into that. While mainstream media recognizes digital success on a much larger scale now than a few years ago, there's still a schism of sorts that I imagine can be difficult to manage at times.

[flarequake]

I saw the phrase in Dan’s tweet on a meme earlier, maybe he saw it and it captures how he feels, though tbh I’m not sure anymore how genuine this kind of tweet is. If it is and he’s looking for reassurance, he sure gets it, I don’t know how much it helps since he didn’t like the fawning praise of his piano playing from everyone loving him so much anyway, I wonder if he can receive everyone’s replies to tweets like this in a genuine way.

Phil’s liveshow was lovely. He said he was in a funny mood and just before that it was clear from some of the expressions he was making, he was smiling in a sneaky-cheeky way. Norman didn’t look very interested on camera, perhaps doesn’t understand the fame. It’s interesting to see him play Limbo. I watched Jacksepticeye’s videos of it and I’ve forgotten how you do everything and how scary it can be. Phil’s doing about as well as I would tbh

[knq]

Perfectionism and imposter syndrome tend to go hand in hand. Add to that a type of career that can be very successful while also being scoffed at and I can certainly see how that would work.

A basic element of imposter syndrome is that you’ve fooled people, so I can’t imagine, even if dan were better at accepting praise to begin with, this particular insecurity would be at all helped by reassurance from his audience. I do think Dan finds solace in being able to express himself though. Sometimes it helps get thoughts out of your head if you put them into the world.

[dogsaremybestfriends]

Okay, here's a totally off-the-wall theory. Is there any possibility that Dan's new project is related to music in some way? We all know that he's got a real passion for it. It was actually one of the reasons I used to think that he might get a job as a DJ (without Phil, that is). Do you think it's possible he would ever get involved in producing music? Or maybe do a bit of singing or playing? I know it's a long shot, and I don't actually believe this at all. It's just an off-the-cuff theory that's been my head for a bit, and I've haven't seen anybody else mention it. I've been imagining him doing this for a while.

I think a slightly more likely theory is that he's written and/or done some acting for mainstream TV. I don't think it will be a presenting job, since he's done that before, and he said it was something new. Could it be some sort of drama or comedy? It would probably sway more towards comedy, since that's what he's mentioned and emphasised so much. Could it be a stand-up show?

Are all my theories just crazily far-fetched? Probably.

[alittledizzy]

Perfectionism and imposter syndrome tend to go hand in hand. Add to that a type of career that can be very successful while also being scoffed at and I can certainly see how that would work.

A basic element of imposter syndrome is that you’ve fooled people, so I can’t imagine, even if dan were better at accepting praise to begin with, this particular insecurity would be at all helped by reassurance from his audience. I do think Dan finds solace in being able to express himself though. Sometimes it helps get thoughts out of your head if you put them into the world.

This is exactly what I think was behind the tweet. It's a genuine feeling masked in a joke, because that's how Dan always expresses genuine feelings.

I am a bit perplexed at people who have been craving a feeling of being connected to him but are rejecting this or annoyed by it. Maybe the difference is that I do always read Dan's 'joke' tweets as being genuine indicators of where his mind is at on some level, and that the humor is just the form in which he's comforting expressing that.

I also don't think that him tweeting this is expecting any emotional labor from his audience (a phrase I saw someone use on tumblr) because of exactly what you said. Feeling like the praise you get is because you tricked people to begin. Tweeting something because you just want to get the feeling out there isn't the same as expecting the people that read it to fix your problem.

[heartsopenminds]

[33:13] Phil hasn’t yet fully committed to his brown hair. He thinks he’s going to keep it brown for a bit, but he also still likes having black hair. He wanted to stop dying it for a bit just to see what it was like.

I wonder if Phil will go back to black hair because it has more of an impact, in the same way he's said he prefers bright coloured clothes to pastel colours?

I like both, Im glad we've been able to see what he looks like with brown hair but think he also can carry off the black.

[wesleywyndcm]

The context of the tweet aside, I was wondering -- and can't recall if it's been brought up before or not -- that the new project might be a podcast? I think it'd give Dan an outlet for what he's good at (talking) without being as "stressful" as filming. Mostly this is wishful thinking because I adore podcasts and would love to listen to one from him, and also because the phrase at the end of the merch tumblr post, about sharing more of himself with us. A podcast episode can easily stretch anywhere between 20 minutes to two hours; plenty of time to waffle about whatever it is he wants to talk about. I'd sell an arm and a leg for that, to be honest.

[flarequake]

I am a bit perplexed at people who have been craving a feeling of being connected to him but are rejecting this or annoyed by it. Maybe the difference is that I do always read Dan's 'joke' tweets as being genuine indicators of where his mind is at on some level, and that the humor is just the form in which he's comforting expressing that.

I’ve just not been sure for ages that he’s genuine, there’s so much on-brand sad/deep/depressing things he tweets. I used to fully believe him, maybe I still should, but with all the ‘oh, they lied about this’ I kept seeing, I started to feel like a fool for believing them and responding. Before that actually, the way he’d pull back later and say he’d only been joking, I wasn’t sure what to believe. My first thought when I saw the tweet was it was an interesting one to come back to us with. Also surprise that he’d still feel like that after having said he’s been a lot better.

[alittledizzy]

I am a bit perplexed at people who have been craving a feeling of being connected to him but are rejecting this or annoyed by it. Maybe the difference is that I do always read Dan's 'joke' tweets as being genuine indicators of where his mind is at on some level, and that the humor is just the form in which he's comforting expressing that.

I’ve just not been sure for ages that he’s genuine, there’s so much on-brand sad/deep/depressing things he tweets. I used to fully believe him, maybe I still should, but with all the ‘oh, they lied about this’ I kept seeing, I started to feel like a fool for believing them and responding. Before that actually, the way he’d pull back later and say he’d only been joking, I wasn’t sure what to believe. My first thought when I saw the tweet was it was an interesting one to come back to us with. Also surprise that he’d still feel like that after having said he’s been a lot better.

In my opinion things like imposter syndrome very rarely fully go away. It may be possible to feel like you did unequivocally good with one project but as soon as there are road blocks in the next one the feeling comes back that you just fooled everyone or that one time was just luck or it was really because of someone else and not you that it succeeded. I think it's even more likely true if this is the first major thing he's done on his own that isn't a youtube video (so he doesn't have the Phil crutch, outside of personal emotional support) and if it's something that's a new arena for him to try and create in.

I also think that Dan being on brand sad/deep/depressing is really the epitome of Dan. Just like he jokes about depressive issues for years before making a video saying he was clinically depressed, or he made jokes about men being hot for years before he came out as gay. For me the things Dan jokes about are almost always things that have a root in truth; his 'schtick' is revealing things about himself in a way that goes hand in hand with being able to pull back and say he's joking when he feels like the scrutiny is too much or like he regrets revealing things about himself.

[Megancita75]

I'll just add, anecdotally, that for me it's during periods of change or transition that all the mental demons I thought I had a handle on come out to play. I see his tweet as genuine, relatable, on brand, meme-ish, and nothing for us to worry about, really.

[alittledizzy]

I'll just add, anecdotally, that for me it's during periods of change or transition that all the mental demons I thought I had a handle on come out to play. I see his tweet as genuine, relatable, on brand, meme-ish, and nothing for us to worry about, really.

Yes! I should also add that none of this is me saying Dan needs to be coddled or protected. Just as I wouldn't ever expect Dan to stop tweeting things he feels because fans are upset with him, I wouldn't expect fans to stop being honest in their own personal spaces (even in their criticism) to shield Dan. Even when I want to challenge things with my personal opinion it's about inter-fandom debate, not about being overprotective of Dan. He is an adult man with plenty of personal support and resources.

[parallel]

I do get mildly concerned for Dan when he emotweets on main. If he's struggling behind the scenes I feel like he usually doesn't tweet that publicly, but public joking-not-joking tweets like this almost remind me of, for instance, That Week In March™ with the "cleanse tone and euthanise" tweet.

I dunno. Personally, I would keep a tweet like that to a private vent twitter or a journal or my therapist or whatever, but I guess Dan can do what he wants.

[autumnhearth]

The context of the tweet aside, I was wondering -- and can't recall if it's been brought up before or not -- that the new project might be a podcast? I think it'd give Dan an outlet for what he's good at (talking) without being as "stressful" as filming. Mostly this is wishful thinking because I adore podcasts and would love to listen to one from him, and also because the phrase at the end of the merch tumblr post, about sharing more of himself with us. A podcast episode can easily stretch anywhere between 20 minutes to two hours; plenty of time to waffle about whatever it is he wants to talk about. I'd sell an arm and a leg for that, to be honest.

I can’t imagine why a podcast would be delayed and pushed back far enough to need reshuffling. And just the way he talked about dropping it as a surprise and tying into merch? I don’t see it. And maybe I have the idea of a joint podcast too set in my head. He keeps emphasize being a comedian. I don’t see him doing his own tour, or but some local shows that are recorded for Netflix? Sure. I also keep thinking about that Lemonade Money following thing back two years ago. Still holding out for that 7 Deadly Sins series, but I might be a fool. Very different, but very Dan... I’m stumped.

[Judearaya]

I also keep thinking about that Lemonade Money following thing back two years ago. Still holding out for that 7 Deadly Sins series, but I might be a fool.

I'm so new -- what does this mean?

[glitterintheair]

I’ll be honest with you pals, a stand up show or venturing into lefttube are both very unappealing ideas to me. But then again if I had to say what I’d love to see Dan do, well... I have no idea. Probably a podcast or a book, either way something that can show us the real Dan, someone more similar to dapg!dan than dinof!dan anyway.

[lovestillaround]

Sorry for getting back to that Dan tweet, but I don't know where people see the joke there? That's a genuine question, I'm not trying to say that anyone is wrong here, I just want to understand other people's perspective but the only thing I see in that tweet is genuine sadness. I don't even see it as a half-joke, like where's the funny part? I don't know, I just can't stop thinking about how differently people perceive this kind of thing because I've seen some people being super concerned and others saying that it's just a joke and I'm quite baffled and feeling out of the loop.