Dan & Phil Part 3: Abs and Angst

[SquishPhan]

At the time the video was posted, neither of them had fans in the same numbers or intensity. I'm sure there were some fans of Phil who were interested in their relationship not even six months in, but phan wasn't a thing as it is now, deep analysis and attempting to prove/disprove everything didn't happen for years on, after it leaked.

in my own experience, people either 1) didn't really care about dan at all, 2) accepted that they were friends, 3) assumed they were dating and wanted to know more but again, didn't really care. the non fanbase viewers (meaning, like, people less involved in the community by not following dailybooth, tweeting ect) were kind of the only ones who thought 2 tbh. if you were more involved in the community then you were used to youtubers being a bit shady with relationships, so it didn't feel unrealistic
plus, there wasnt any proof to look for and there wasnt much secrecy, since pretty much everything was posted publicly and felt like something you could know. cherry was probably about the only unexplained joke, and it wasnt that hard to work out

Based on options 1 and 3, the entire concept of 'ooh, we're a couple!' as a prank is completely silly in the first place, then. And presumably the people that qualified for option 2 wouldn't have cared enough to make the prank actually successful.

Exactly. For me the concept that the video is a prank, just doesn't make sense. I'm firmly in the I believe it's real camp, and will happily stay there.

[jaej]

Was it filmed in 2010? And can you wonderful people also refresh my memory when it leaked again? The dreadful 2012?

it was filmed in february 2010, but i don't know the exact date. 13th? but the first leak was in 2011! i was just getting back into the phandom after a year and a half of not really caring, so i missed the video but saw the confusion in the tumblr tags. it would have been september/october i think? so a little before dan hit 100k subs, and before they were planning the first radio show. it cropped up a lot in early/mid 2012 (nothing before march, at least) after people managed to download the first leak (and each time it was posted, more people would download and later repost) so that just made tensions worse


honestly though, i don't remember the first vday leak being a big deal. you either accepted that it was a prank, or you thought they were lying but didnt really question it much, phil was still under 200k so there wasnt a large enough group of people to panic. the first big, real phandom drama was either the vlog with cat where dan was EVIL AND IGNORED PHIL (ie spent more time talking to someone they never get to see) or dan getting 200k a couple of months after phil did, when it took phil 2-3 years to get from 100k to 200k, when it took dan just a few months. constant vday leaks just made it tenser and caused drama through people screaming at each other about whether or not it should be posted. 2012 was a weird year, but more due to the phandom in the first half of the year. it was a mess.

[swofro]

Was it filmed in 2010?

And can you wonderful people also refresh my memory when it leaked again? The dreadful 2012?

Filmed in 2010. Leaked on a small scale in September 2011. Leaked more widely in November 2012.

EDITED because I am an idiot and didn't read the previous post

[loststars]

Was it filmed in 2010?

And can you wonderful people also refresh my memory when it leaked again? The dreadful 2012?

Filmed in 2010. Leaked on a small scale in September 2011. Leaked more widely in November 2012.

Ahaa yeah, I was starting to confuse the dates. Thank you, senpai!

Oh wow, thanks so much for the background info, jaej! It sure seems like a big giant mess, I haven't witnessed anything first-hand prior to 2013, which is when it all got better (seemingly).

Off to watch The WL now

[SquishPhan]

Was it filmed in 2010? And can you wonderful people also refresh my memory when it leaked again? The dreadful 2012?

it was filmed in february 2010, but i don't know the exact date. 13th? but the first leak was in 2011! i was just getting back into the phandom after a year and a half of not really caring, so i missed the video but saw the confusion in the tumblr tags. it would have been september/october i think? so a little before dan hit 100k subs, and before they were planning the first radio show. it cropped up a lot in early/mid 2012 (nothing before march, at least) after people managed to download the first leak (and each time it was posted, more people would download and later repost) so that just made tensions worse


honestly though, i don't remember the first vday leak being a big deal. you either accepted that it was a prank, or you thought they were lying but didnt really question it much, phil was still under 200k. the first big, real phandom drama was either the vlog with cat where dan was EVIL AND IGNORED PHIL (ie spent more time talking to someone they never get to see) or dan getting 200k a couple of months after phil did, when it took phil 2-3 years to get from 100k to 200k, when it took dan just a few months. constant vday leaks just made it tenser and caused drama through people screaming at each other about whether or not it should be posted. 2012 was a weird year, but more due to the phandom in the first half of the year. it was a mess.

This makes me glad that I wasn't in the phandom back then, because it does sounds like a mess and not such a fun time. To be honest I think that if I were in the phadom during that time, I wouldn't have stuck around. Because on top of all that drama, came 2012 Dan and I don't think I would have been happy with him and his attitude. So kudos to all who managed to stick around during that time period, I would have abandoned ship. Luckily I came in on the right time just before Japhan , so everyone was in a good mood.

[coffee pig]

At the time the video was posted, neither of them had fans in the same numbers or intensity. I'm sure there were some fans of Phil who were interested in their relationship not even six months in, but phan wasn't a thing as it is now, deep analysis and attempting to prove/disprove everything didn't happen for years on, after it leaked.

in my own experience, people either 1) didn't really care about dan at all, 2) accepted that they were friends, 3) assumed they were dating and wanted to know more but again, didn't really care. the non fanbase viewers (meaning, like, people less involved in the community by not following dailybooth, tweeting ect) were kind of the only ones who thought 2 tbh. if you were more involved in the community then you were used to youtubers being a bit shady with relationships, so it didn't feel unrealistic
plus, there wasnt any proof to look for and there wasnt much secrecy, since pretty much everything was posted publicly and felt like something you could know. cherry was probably about the only unexplained joke, and it wasnt that hard to work out

Based on options 1 and 3, the entire concept of 'ooh, we're a couple!' as a prank is completely silly in the first place, then. And presumably the people that qualified for option 2 wouldn't have cared enough to make the prank actually successful.

Exactly. For me the concept that the video is a prank, just doesn't make sense. I'm firmly in the I believe it's real camp, and will happily stay there.

I've been subscribed to Phil since 2008, witnessed most of this first-hand and remember seeing Dan in the first PINOF and kind of wondering in the back of my head if they were together, but not really caring that much. That was the general consensus of Phil's subscribers at the time as well. You got maybe a few people commenting 'are you guys gay' on the video, but that was about it. I was, shamefully, convinced enough by Dan's rants in 2012 to believe that they were just friends (and so put off by his attitude that I stopped watching for a few years) until recently.

[akui]

What I find really interesting/ironic is that, assuming Dan and Phil are in a relationship, the reason they have been able to stay in the 'glass closet' so long is precisely because of their massive, rabid shipping fanbase, not depite of it. 'Phan' shippers are lumped in with the likes of Larry and Jaspar shippers, written off as delusional, annoying teenage girls who will ship any two attractive guys who are within close proximity of each other. The idea of 'Phan' became more and more a joke to people, including other YouTubers, when 'Phan' became this massively popular, mainstream thing to ship. (Before Felix met Dan and Phil, for instance, I remember him talking about Dan and Phil in a video, being like: 'Everyone want to see them fuck, but it's never going to happen,' or something along those lines.) Dan and Phil keep this up by occasionally liking mildly romantic fanart on Tumblr and talking openly about reading their own fanfiction because, if they are were actually in a closeted relationship they would never do that, right? Not to mention that because of their sense of humor, people won't take anything they say seriously. It's actually incredible to me that Dan literally said that he only started watching an anime for the boys in speedos, and people still think he's joking. They are essentially hiding in plain sight, which is both impressive and massively stressful. I don't envy them on that front.

Yep, precisely, the most dangerous place is the most safest place. Hide truth in a lie, the truth become a part of the lie.

Just no sure it's because they are smart or they are lucky.

[wtfamidoinghere]

I saw voldy before the timeline or (any other poof) and believed it was a joke. Until i saw all the old tweets etc. But a part of me refuses to believe it's real, because if it is, then i can't even put into words how bad i feel for Phil (and in extention Dan. Not as much, but having such intimate details of your relationship revealed can't be fun either). So i believe it was a prank, even if they are a couple. No idea how delusional that is, but i will probably keep believing it.

One thing: I keep seeing people comment how they would be bad people if it was indeed a prank, because it would have been cruel. But they chose to not make it public in the end, so that is kind of irrelevant? If i think about doing something illegal, but then decide not to do it, then i sure hope i won't go to jail. I didn't do anything wrong after all
And they apparently realized it would be too cruel to shippers and that's why they decided not to do it. I wouldn't blaim them for something they didn't do.

EDIT: I can totally see Emma Blackery showing Felix and Marzia voldy and/or the timeline (or at least telling them about it). She can't shut up about them on twitter, wouldn't surprise me if she brings them up with friends.
So besides meeting them, that could also be a reason why Felix talks about them so differently now.

[elias]

questions:
- is that a face with dark skin and large lips upside down next to the push button in Dan's?
- what do the words say in that framed picture in the same area?

Here's a close up for you.

I have no idea what his intentions behind the drawing were, but it looks a lot like the racist caricatures of black people in the 20’s? The fact that he wrote Bob Marley’s lyrics next to it makes it even weirder.

Trigger Warning :

racist imagery

[mez29]

I'm not so sure that does say "no woman no cry"? It could be "the amazing book fire", with people standing next to it? Although I don't suppose he'd have known what the cover was going to look like at that stage.

[yonahime]

I saw voldy before the timeline or (any other poof) and believed it was a joke. Until i saw all the old tweets etc. But a part of me refuses to believe it's real, because if it is, then i can't even put into words how bad i feel for Phil (and in extention Dan. Not as much, but having such intimate details of your relationship revealed can't be fun either). So i believe it was a prank, even if they are a couple. No idea how delusional that is, but i will probably keep believing it.

One thing: I keep seeing people comment how they would be bad people if it was indeed a prank, because it would have been cruel. But they chose to not make it public in the end, so that is kind of irrelevant? If i think about doing something illegal, but then decide not to do it, then i sure hope i won't go to jail. I didn't do anything wrong after all
And they apparently realized it would be too cruel to shippers and that's why they decided not to do it. I wouldn't blaim them for something they didn't do.

EDIT: I can totally see Emma Blackery showing Felix and Marzia voldy and/or the timeline (or at least telling them about it). She can't shut up about them on twitter, wouldn't surprise me if she brings them up with friends.

But the thing is, they did do it. If it was a prank, they did filmed it, edited it, uploaded it. The only thing they didn't do was leak it themselves. Even if they decided not to go through with it, i wouldn't say it was the same as just thinking about it.

I only watched voldy once, after reading the timeline. I manage to hold it and not search for it for a while, until the curiosity was killing me and DD was born. It made me uncomfortable and guilty. soz

Edit: Re: drawing
It doesn't look like the first word was 'No' to me, more like 'The'. And it looks more 'man' than 'woman'. I understand that it could look either way though.

[daphenaxa]

questions:
- is that a face with dark skin and large lips upside down next to the push button in Dan's?
- what do the words say in that framed picture in the same area?

Here's a close up for you.

I have no idea what his intentions behind the drawing were, but it looks a lot like the racist caricatures of black people in the 20’s? The fact that he wrote Bob Marley’s lyrics next to it makes it even weirder.

Trigger Warning :

racist imagery

I thought it was a painting palette to go with the easel. But i can't unsee now (not saying that's what he drew/meant tho)

[angrymob]

I saw voldy before the timeline or (any other poof) and believed it was a joke. Until i saw all the old tweets etc. But a part of me refuses to believe it's real, because if it is, then i can't even put into words how bad i feel for Phil (and in extention Dan. Not as much, but having such intimate details of your relationship revealed can't be fun either). So i believe it was a prank, even if they are a couple. No idea how delusional that is, but i will probably keep believing it.

One thing: I keep seeing people comment how they would be bad people if it was indeed a prank, because it would have been cruel. But they chose to not make it public in the end, so that is kind of irrelevant? If i think about doing something illegal, but then decide not to do it, then i sure hope i won't go to jail. I didn't do anything wrong after all
And they apparently realized it would be too cruel to shippers and that's why they decided not to do it. I wouldn't blaim them for something they didn't do.

I really struggle to believe that they'd film something in 2010 to mess with shippers. I don't even think shipping was a mainstream concept yet at that time, when in 2009, slashing was still the main thing like that and people were a lot less up front about that stuff and a lot less likely to do it with random people that weren't mainstream celebrities (which Dan and Phil were definitely not). I don't even think it would have been that cruel at the time, since if it was a prank they would have come forward about that soon after. I can certainly see if it was a prank, but I don't buy the whole explanation of it being to mess with shippers and them then finding that too cruel. That sounds like something they came up with a few years later when concepts like shipping and queerbaiting were more popular.

[swofro]

I'm not so sure that does say "no woman no cry"? It could be "the amazing book fire", with people standing next to it? Although I don't suppose he'd have known what the cover was going to look like at that stage.

Yes, it could be that too bcause I first thought the first word is 'The' but since I read the thing underneath it as woman, my mind automatically think it is 'no'.

And here I thought the thing next to the word is some flagpole. We can never know with Dan's handwriting.

[wtfamidoinghere]

I saw voldy before the timeline or (any other poof) and believed it was a joke. Until i saw all the old tweets etc. But a part of me refuses to believe it's real, because if it is, then i can't even put into words how bad i feel for Phil (and in extention Dan. Not as much, but having such intimate details of your relationship revealed can't be fun either). So i believe it was a prank, even if they are a couple. No idea how delusional that is, but i will probably keep believing it.

One thing: I keep seeing people comment how they would be bad people if it was indeed a prank, because it would have been cruel. But they chose to not make it public in the end, so that is kind of irrelevant? If i think about doing something illegal, but then decide not to do it, then i sure hope i won't go to jail. I didn't do anything wrong after all
And they apparently realized it would be too cruel to shippers and that's why they decided not to do it. I wouldn't blaim them for something they didn't do.

EDIT: I can totally see Emma Blackery showing Felix and Marzia voldy and/or the timeline (or at least telling them about it). She can't shut up about them on twitter, wouldn't surprise me if she brings them up with friends.

But the thing is, they did do it. If it was a prank, they did filmed it, edited it, uploaded it. The only thing they didn't do was leak it themselves. Even if they decided not to go through with it, i wouldn't say it was the same as just thinking about it.

I still wouldn't blaim someone for something they didn't do. No matter how much they prepared for it. It's easy to get caught up in a joke. As long as they stopped to think about it and decided against it in the end, i won't hold it against them.

I really struggle to believe that they'd film something in 2010 to mess with shippers. I don't even think shipping was a mainstream concept yet at that time, when in 2009, slashing was still the main thing like that and people were a lot less up front about that stuff and a lot less likely to do it with random people that weren't mainstream celebrities (which Dan and Phil were definitely not). I don't even think it would have been that cruel at the time, since if it was a prank they would have come forward about that soon after. I can certainly see if it was a prank, but I don't buy the whole explanation of it being to mess with shippers and them then finding that too cruel. That sounds like something they came up with a few years later when concepts like shipping and queerbaiting were more popular.

Oh, i wasn't trying to "proof" that voldy isn't real. Just saying i have to believe it's not real, because otherwise i would feel too bad.
(From the perspective of "voldy isn't real": They could have just realized that the video looked too real and people wouldn't believe it was a joke. But when it leaked, the "feeling bad about being cruel to shippers" seemed like a better explanation for why they decided against publishing it.)

[Anonymousse]

Watching the WL:
1) God darn UK and it's weird dialects. I really needed some subtitles to understand what the F was being said.

2) Phil is so sassy-sassy, I love sassy Phil

[loststars]

Today I was looking at the D&P calendar and find this




And that's all about me for today. Good night

Haha aww

[awkwardly]

re voldy

ah, the first topic since I joined over at GG that I can say about that I see it return it feels nice - the idea of topics returning to be discussed I mean. idk I just feel accomplished like '1st milestone'. so I'm one of the 50/50 people (still) - when I first stumbled upon it on tumblr (after already knowing what it is), first I didn't wanted to see it cause I was worried that yes, I will see it's a joke and I'll feel bad as part of lgbt+ and won't be able to watch their videos anymore... but then I watched it in the end anyway. and I thought that Phil isn't that good of an actor to pull that of as elaborate script, and the ending felt just too real (the ending was the only part that I had to pause cause oh.my.god that part felt like watching something very private ). but then the drawings... idk... it's just weird to put that into a video (but I'm the least romantic person in the world so what do I know also I just don't know anyone irl who would add something like that). So if it was just one no cuts just talk recording I would be 110% on the it's real boat. also after I started discovering Phil's old videos I think he could act that (still thinking the last bit is real though) and also I see how he could see it from creative pov and not from a prank pov - if not real. so it would be easier on consciousness for him to script and record. if it was a prank - then maybe they were thinking about the impact only after they saw the finished product. if it was prank and they realized the impact that it might have after watching it, why didn't they delete it right away? why did they keep it on the channel? like srsly for what purpouse? that is my main question if it's a prank that they decided was too cruel. why leave it online? did they enjoy watching it for the lolz about the fandom? like srsly imagine them sitting and going nah, that is too cruel, but lets keep it online cause...aliens? but maybe it was not right away. maybe something during late march made them decide not to publish it. and then cause they are lazy just not deleting it cause they didn't care about it, but what also makes me wonder is why are there not more abandoned projects that were unprivated? like was this the only thing that they ever made and not decided to publish? I don't know how was they publishing moral back then - if they always published something they uploaded right away or if they sometimes prerecorded something few days before (not a whole month obv) and then make it public later... so it being the only thing that got unprivated is just weird unless that is how that glitch worked it's way through yt. so idk, this says nothing about phan for me personally but I still keep the vid as 50/50

also Dan's soul is squid ink spaghetti says Phil

also I'm probably the last person who is resisting to watch TWL cause I fear cringing (but everyone says they didn't so I might give it a go during weekend) but I admire you all for your skills (reminds me of old days in other fandom early 2000 dealing secret stuff by actual post via actual VHS )

[DryCereal]

Watching the WL:
1) God darn UK and it's weird dialects. I really needed some subtitles to understand what the F was being said.

2) Phil is so sassy-sassy, I love sassy Phil

Quite a few Northerners there! Lancashire, Merseyside, Manchester, Yorkshire... Anyway. If you timestamp the most annoying parts, I can transcribe/translate(!) if you want.

Today I was looking at the D&P calendar and find this





And that's all about me for today. Good night

Haha aww

Straight out of Phil's dress-up collection. Like the tiara and the necklace apparently.

[yonahime]

I saw voldy before the timeline or (any other poof) and believed it was a joke. Until i saw all the old tweets etc. But a part of me refuses to believe it's real, because if it is, then i can't even put into words how bad i feel for Phil (and in extention Dan. Not as much, but having such intimate details of your relationship revealed can't be fun either). So i believe it was a prank, even if they are a couple. No idea how delusional that is, but i will probably keep believing it.

One thing: I keep seeing people comment how they would be bad people if it was indeed a prank, because it would have been cruel. But they chose to not make it public in the end, so that is kind of irrelevant? If i think about doing something illegal, but then decide not to do it, then i sure hope i won't go to jail. I didn't do anything wrong after all
And they apparently realized it would be too cruel to shippers and that's why they decided not to do it. I wouldn't blaim them for something they didn't do.

EDIT: I can totally see Emma Blackery showing Felix and Marzia voldy and/or the timeline (or at least telling them about it). She can't shut up about them on twitter, wouldn't surprise me if she brings them up with friends.

But the thing is, they did do it. If it was a prank, they did filmed it, edited it, uploaded it. The only thing they didn't do was leak it themselves. Even if they decided not to go through with it, i wouldn't say it was the same as just thinking about it.

I still wouldn't blaim someone for something they didn't do. No matter how much they prepared for it. It's easy to get caught up in a joke. As long as they stopped to think about it and decided against it in the end, i won't hold it against them.

I wouldn't really blame them either. I know they did a lot of problematic things in the past but i believe they are a better person now. Saying that, i would also understand that people may get upset at thought of them even filming it.

Watching the WL:
1) God darn UK and it's weird dialects. I really needed some subtitles to understand what the F was being said.

2) Phil is so sassy-sassy, I love sassy Phil

i know your struggle. I barely understand what the questions even were, especially since it was fast.

[starlight-still]

Off Topic (ish):

Woke up with two songs in my head this morning.
First one:


cough it's way too early for those lips I've got work
Second one:


And therein lie the polar extremes of phan.

And now there's voldy talk going down. I'm ashamed to admit...I've seen it. The whole kit and kaboodle. I didn't even turn away, though I felt very, very for both of them. And thoughts below:

I couldn't walk away believing that voldy wasn't real on some level. But a thought I've had recently that might reconcile some of the apparent inconsistencies (how can it seem so sincere yet 2012 Dan insists it was an April Fool's joke; how can they talk about such intimate details as ; why does Phil have the armada out for it, etc.).

There are many shades of 'real' between voldy-was-made-when-Deppy-were-a-couple-and-was-100%-sincere and voldy-was-just-a-joke-Deppy-are-bropals-4-lyfe-u-foolz. Such as:

- What if voldy was conceived and scripted as a joke, but when Phil actually went and recorded it, his honest feelings for Dan made it seem much more sincere than intended?
- What if voldy was a joke at the time, but then later their relationship went through highs and los (as they do) and the 2012 "leak" was done intentionally by Phil (with resistance from Dan), hence Dan's shutting it down and Phil's radio silence? #voldywasaninsidejob

I don't put it above foeti!them to make a prank video of that nature...they were young and pushing their own creative boundaries, and whether or not it's real both seem to know now what the implications are (yep, I caught Phil's little nod in the last ls too). Even the thing...they were both a bit more back then, no?

I find it hard to believe that they weren't, at the very least, infatuated with one another in those early days (tweets, posts). Whether they were fwb, romantically involved (but not physical), or even just very very close friends who helped each other through tough times, we'll most likely never know (and honestly, that's their business unless they choose to share at some point down the road).

For those who are wise/moral enough to stay away from voldy talk...I salute you. Basic summary of what I wrote: me =

[coffee pig]

There are many shades of 'real' between voldy-was-made-when-Deppy-were-a-couple-and-was-100%-sincere and voldy-was-just-a-joke-Deppy-are-bropals-4-lyfe-u-foolz. Such as:

- What if voldy was conceived and scripted as a joke, but when Phil actually went and recorded it, his honest feelings for Dan made it seem much more sincere than intended?
- What if voldy was a joke at the time, but then later their relationship went through highs and los (as they do) and the 2012 "leak" was done intentionally by Phil (with resistance from Dan), hence Dan's shutting it down and Phil's radio silence? #voldywasaninsidejob

You are all going to hate me for this, I'm going to have to bring it up again for the first time in the new forum....Occam's Razor. Generally speaking, the simplest assumptions in life are usually the correct ones.

[phamnotof]

Today I was looking at the D&P calendar and find this




And that's all about me for today. Good night

Haha aww

I came here to tell y'all that I accidentally stumbled upon Alfie's younow show and now am grateful even for the worst and moodiest of D&P's ones, I didn't expect to be assaulted by feelings.

[starlight-still]

You are all going to hate me for this, I'm going to have to bring it up again for the first time in the new forum....Occam's Razor. Generally speaking, the simplest assumptions in life are usually the correct ones.

I got you- I'm still so new, I'm going to have to work through all the phases before I can reach a state of reason and common sense

It's kinda fun tho I can't help it

[hola]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cMs5YNrBvkg&nohtml5=False
Someone posted the link of Phil on the weakest link on YouTube and cat-and-bear-savestheworld (they are a big blog) reblogged the link to it. They also link to this website in the description. I don't know if u wanted the video shared but it's out there now