Dan & Phil Part 42: lying makes you go to hell

[jesp]

all of the mod posts seem a bit like the famous awkward stop talking oscar speech music trying to usher out the numerous sexuality and relationship discussions in the nicest way possible

I've been waiting for a gap in the conversation so I wouldn't interrupt it.

[cherrybomb3]

all of the mod posts seem a bit like the famous awkward stop talking oscar speech music trying to usher out the numerous sexuality and relationship discussions in the nicest way possible

I've been waiting for a gap in the conversation so I wouldn't interrupt it.

oh goodness sorry i wasnt genuinely attacking you ignore me

[jesp]

oh goodness sorry i wasnt genuinely attacking you ignore me

Don't worry, I didn't think you were. I was just waiting for a gap so that my post wouldn't be buried in the middle of a discussion, and so that it didn't seem like an attempt to stop conversation - I'd be direct and tell people to stop, in any case.

[Catallena]

Nevermind me, just staying in my lane as a tragically straight person for once and reacting to this little thing that diverts from the ongoing discussion that I find interesting.

My thoughts exactly. I've always had a theory that Dan and Phil get lot of views for more than their videos or personalities. Don't get me wrong, I think they'd still be successful if they were open about these things, but not as much. People want to look for hints about their sexuality/relationship status. There's a sense of ambiguity and mystery. Without that, I'm not sure how well their channels would hold up.

Side note: I know that we don't really know about their relationship status, this is just my opinion.

I just want to say that I think people overestimate the power of shipping with Dan and Phil. I watched them both loyally for years and years, bought the books, went to Tatinof and the whole serious shipping aspect of their personalities honestly never occurred to me until I decided to look them up on Tumblr.

So Dan and Phil most likely have an enormous section of their fanbase who just watch their content and don't really think any deeper other wondering as a passing thought what their personal lives are like.

To me there are 3 types of people who watch D&P:
The Hardcore Phandom who are super involved on social media and include small of crazies on this forum They are usually shippers (not always because we have plenty of nonbelievers and agnostics on here as well, but the majority is) and a good part of that group even thinks it's real after seeing ~the evidence~ that has been acquired over the years like old tweets and the vday vid. This is the part of the audience where most fanworks and D&P related memes are made and where the theories and deep analyzing of everything they do goes on as well. Apart from being a hot mess, this group will also literally watch anything for Depz and thus although it's not the biggest part of their audience that all definitely makes it the most influential part and the most important in keeping any kind of hype around them alive. They buy merch, sat through all the radio shows, powered through the tour drought without becoming a kpop stan for the same few boy groups.. That sorta thing

The 'Normal' Phandom The biggest part of the actual fandom. Definitely not casuals as they consume all their content, but not as crazy as some of us hardcore people either. They all care a lot, but not THAT much. They watch videos, bought the books, might even have attended TATINOF (confusing the f out of me because I feel like there are so many jokes in those that are geared towards the demon phannies). They might follow D&P on Twitter or Tumblr and maybe some popular fan accounts that post gifs and shit that they reblog but beyond that they're not involved in fandom activity. Some might ship Phan, but most of them have no idea about any of the ~proof~ and probably think it's kind of creepy to analyze all of that and that we're going a bit too far with the theories. That is, if they even find out because I'm pretty sure most of them are blissfully unaware about how big the Phan thing actually is. They really don't give a damn about D&P's personal lives, they signed up to be entertained and nothing else. That would be the part you described starry nightworld

The Casuals Irrelevant. It's likely that they really only watch Dan, they make up most of his view counts. Think we're all crazy delulu's for shipping real people, and do not interact with the phandom anywhere. Wonder if a Tumblr is some weird British thing that you can eat. idk can't relate.

Anyway I don't think there is such a thing as 'the power of shipping' but only the power of which part of the phandom you get swept up in. As the demon phannies are so influential and D&P do tend to pander to the people who kinda make them relevant in the first place (a lot of the opportunities they get are because there's little risk of them completely flopping because we won't allow that shit to happen) I do think that the *wink wink nudge nudge* references to shipping and the ambiguity of the relationship that they show the outside worlds is on purpose because it keeps those people hooked. I don't think that necessarily says much about how genuine or not their relationship and interactions are, just that it's gotta be something in the back of their minds of all times. Gotta pay the bills yo.

This post was supposed to have more of a conclusive point but I'm tired and my English skills are getting worse by the second so night night my lovelies~

[pastelspectre]

im not good at putting my thoughts into words bleh soz

just want to say uh in the midst of this stuff that i will still support dan and phil no matter what their relationship is and uh...yeah uhm. i'll go now sorry im bad at stuff like this

[kalli]

i hope i'm not misreading the tone when i continue with the discussion because i found fancybum's post and some of the replies really interesting. not to pick on the post that sparked it, but i'm kind of a nitpicker when it comes to the term "closeted" too, because to me, it always carries the notion of, on one hand, that it is an involuntary and temporary state from which, on the other hand, you can only escape by a formal announcement. a coming out, on the other hand, puts imo the whole responsibility of explaining, educating, and enduring all possible outcomes to the person coming out. to me, what dan has been doing lately with terms of mentioning attraction to men is really inspiring, because it kind of destroys these notions by skipping the whole coming out step, which, as trivial as it may sound, i never before fully realised a person could just do. therefore, it rubs me the wrong way when people still consider dan "closeted", because it often gives me the impression that whatever he says is brushed aside as long as he doesn't make a formal coming out video, tattoes "i'm not straight" on his forehead, or something similar.

i'd also say that for this reason, if dan and phil are in a relationship, it's not a closeted one, but simply a secret one. with terms to that, however, i'd see it the other way round: it really is undetermined as long as they don't choose to tell us, and nothing they do is "proof" for anything. but i also feel that it's important to recognize that what they share about them is their choice, like fancybum said. they could make an official announcement. they could have also chosen to share less than they do.

it sounds a bit silly when i type it out loud, but i think that the way dan has been dealing with his sexuality is rather inspiring, in a non-corny-actually-affirming way. before he acted like this i was rather unsure about how to discuss my bisexuality, and so i started to just approach it with self deprecating nonchalance and offhanded comments. seeing dan do the same sort of helped me come to terms with the fact that the way i was dealing with my sexuality was (to use the current fave word) valid and not deficient or unworthy

dan howell, lgbt activist since 2015ish

I agree with both of these. I don't feel like they're trying to hide anything, they're just not explicitly sharing these aspects of themselves and their lives. The way they've handled it, especially Dan in regard to his sexuality, is quite inspiring to me as well. I couldn't even guess the number of times I've told people "I'm not really attracted to anyone" but I've only ever used the term asexual a couple times when specifically discussing sexuality. Labels are a great way to learn about yourself and/or other people, and to validate your feelings when you don't match up with society's "norm" but it's up to the individual to decide whether or not they want to use it and come out to people with it. I don't like the concept of coming out because, as people have already mentioned, it feels heteronormative, but I get that it can be quite liberating to some so to each their own. Essentially, it's important to realize that it's not mandatory for a non-straight person to come out and people shouldn't be defaulted to heterosexual just because they haven't labelled themselves otherwise.

I feel like it's slightly different with their relationship since "I find *male* attractive" is a lot more to the point than the hints at them being in a relationship. Some tweets (such as "Uma Thurman just watched me have sex" from Dan while he was staying at Phil's house), and a bunch of formspring answers (such as the "---" answer when Phil was asked who was the last person he wanted to kiss, followed by Dan replying "hmm ---" when someone asked if he wanted to kiss Phil too) pretty heavily imply that were at least at some point involved with each other in a not-so-platonic sense, but recently it's just been their interactions and stuff like Dan visiting Phil's family, which aren't quite as blunt and persuasive. But even with that being said, I agree that their relationship shouldn't be considered closeted either. They're not really trying to hide anything anymore and they don't seem to care about people believing they're in a relationship, they're just not announcing it.

(Just to clarify, I really don't feel like the original comment that sparked this topic was meant to be offensive in any way. Secret may have been a better choice of words, but closeted was simply used to mean the same thing. It's definitely made for an interesting discussion though.)

[saffarinda]

hey, this is pretty off topic to the convo that's been going on here - but i was wondering where the theories regarding dnp moving started from? i didn't really start to believe them until dans "relocating wirrow painting" in his lastest liveshow, but i'd seen mentions of it all over the place. was it just because of the talk of how noisy their apartment is, and how little storage space they have?

[malday]

sort of related to the discussion (or at least one of the 15 that are currently occuring), but i sort of hope that phil feels comfortable enough with his own sexuality to casually bant about it more like dan does. i know he does make mention of male crushes and pulls off some top notch innuendos, but it doesnt seem like hes at the same level as dan just yet - just look at his reaction to dans innuendo in awsugar's signature thingy


or im just being presumptuous and forcing my opinions and expectations on phil

Phil's reaction in that gif has more to do with not wanting to confirm phan than male attraction, even Dan backed down and apologized.
Phil's style is being subtle, what more than "we like the cock" or "i did something inappropriate to the tin man" do you want from him, he's not gonna thirst about male celebrities openly like Dan does.

[sugar]

sort of related to the discussion (or at least one of the 15 that are currently occuring), but i sort of hope that phil feels comfortable enough with his own sexuality to casually bant about it more like dan does. i know he does make mention of male crushes and pulls off some top notch innuendos, but it doesnt seem like hes at the same level as dan just yet - just look at his reaction to dans innuendo in awsugar's signature thingy


or im just being presumptuous and forcing my opinions and expectations on phil

Phil's reaction in that gif has more to do with not wanting to confirm phan than male attraction, even Dan backed down and apologized.
Phil's style is being subtle, what more than "we like the cock" or "i did something inappropriate to the tin man" do you want from him, he's not gonna thirst about male celebrities openly like Dan does.

i feel like phil has made a few more direct comments, though i can't think of them off the top of my head right now.

personally, the examples you gave don't prove anything to me. if he made those two comments and there was no other reason to believe that either of them wasn't straight i'd consider it an extreme reach. they have relevance in both situations and i could see a straight guy saying the same thing without it really meaning anything. on the other hand, if you took away everything else but dan's comments about evan peters being his celebrity crush, it's a lot different. it's an explicit statement of attraction to a male. i know phil is more subtle but i don't think a joke about the tin man in any way implies anything about his sexuality or should be used as evidence.

[SexyTrashCan]

http://ratinof.tumblr.com/post/15509607 ... -that-phil Just putting this post here to show that Phil male attraction does exist it's just *a lot* less prevalent than it is with Dan

[onetruetrash]

hey, this is pretty off topic to the convo that's been going on here - but i was wondering where the theories regarding dnp moving started from? i didn't really start to believe them until dans "relocating wirrow painting" in his lastest liveshow, but i'd seen mentions of it all over the place. was it just because of the talk of how noisy their apartment is, and how little storage space they have?

It was mentions of stress and exhaustion by Dan that really made people start talking.

[scientia]

hey, this is pretty off topic to the convo that's been going on here - but i was wondering where the theories regarding dnp moving started from? i didn't really start to believe them until dans "relocating wirrow painting" in his lastest liveshow, but i'd seen mentions of it all over the place. was it just because of the talk of how noisy their apartment is, and how little storage space they have?

It was mentions of stress and exhaustion by Dan that really made people start talking.

Also, both Dan and Phil mentioned on several occasions that they needed additional #storage.

[fancy_nancy]

I'm as excited as everyone else is about them moving but I hate that when if it happens it's not going to stay private for a long time. Someones going to find the house on a listing or something and then photos will surface and then theres going to be the whole thing that happens every few weeks anyways where half the people in the phandom are going to be like "respect their privacy!!1!" and the other half is going to say "idgaf, not my fault they signed up for this life" aaaand hahah I need to stop being pessimistic about something that's maybe not going to happen

[Susanisnotafish]

This came into my sub box today and I have many thoughts/questions. So as there seems to be a lull here I hope no one minds me posting this now.



1) interesting the first gift was a plushie and the most recent a pic of Angel in the tub. Went from G rated to PG-13 (American motion picture rating system) But the Dan was 18 at the time of the plushie and Phil was turning 30.

2) I love that Dan says the plushie was, "probably the single best present anyone's ever given me in my entire life". What about any gifts his gf of 3 years ever gave him?

3) I wonder why Dan chose the music that says, "on the 8th day of Christmas my babygave to me"

4) In 2011 Dan chose the Buffy shirt to give Phil that said "the future is ours" on it. Surely there were other choices?

5) 2016 Dan says "Phil knows me well" with no sarcasm, but 2017 Dan says Phil's his "bestest buddy" with extreme sarcasm, but then sounding genuine he says, "and he knows me well."

6) Is it just me or does them doing things with couples (Wirral & Bryiny, Pj and soph, Felix and marzia) make it seem more likely they're in a relationship?

7) in light of Oqua'svid about their sushi kink, I find it hilarious that Dan gave Phil candy sushi for his bday.

8) also hilarious about the lava lamp bc of Dan's fetus vid about the lava lamp being his penis. Phil symbolically was gifted the D.

Some of this is a shit post, but love to hear people's thoughts and reactions to this vid.

[lefthandedism]

[offtopic]I was listening to the radio this morning and there was a news story about internet addiction. It used the example of a 14-year-old girl in California who started to spend all her time in her room watching YouTube videos. According to the story, she apparently "started with funny videos from twentysomething YouTubers", and they played a short clip. That's right: "Hello, Internet, my name is Dan."

Dan Howell is the gateway drug (not that anyone here would know anything about that ).

(The girl has real mental health issues and is being treated for them. I obviously don't think there is anything funny about her situation.)[/offtopic]

[onetruetrash]

[offtopic]I was listening to the radio this morning and there was a news story about internet addiction. It used the example of a 14-year-old girl in California who started to spend all her time in her room watching YouTube videos. According to the story, she apparently "started with funny videos from twentysomething YouTubers", and they played a short clip. That's right: "Hello, Internet, my name is Dan."

Dan Howell is the gateway drug (not that anyone here would know anything about that ).

(The girl has real mental health issues and is being treated for them. I obviously don't think there is anything funny about her situation.)[/offtopic]

[offtopic]Dang, that's... wow. I wonder how Dan would feel if he headed that.[/offtopic]

[saffarinda]

This came into my sub box today and I have many thoughts/questions. So as there seems to be a lull here I hope no one minds me posting this now.



1) interesting the first gift was a plushie and the most recent a pic of Angel in the tub. Went from G rated to PG-13 (American motion picture rating system) But the Dan was 18 at the time of the plushie and Phil was turning 30.

2) I love that Dan says the plushie was, "probably the single best present anyone's ever given me in my entire life". What about any gifts his gf of 3 years ever gave him?

3) I wonder why Dan chose the music that says, "on the 8th day of Christmas my babygave to me"

4) In 2011 Dan chose the Buffy shirt to give Phil that said "the future is ours" on it. Surely there were other choices?

5) 2016 Dan says "Phil knows me well" with no sarcasm, but 2017 Dan says Phil's his "bestest buddy" with extreme sarcasm, but then sounding genuine he says, "and he knows me well."

6) Is it just me or does them doing things with couples (Wirral & Bryiny, Pj and soph, Felix and marzia) make it seem more likely they're in a relationship?

7) in light of Oqua'svid about their sushi kink, I find it hilarious that Dan gave Phil candy sushi for his bday.

8) also hilarious about the lava lamp bc of Dan's fetus vid about the lava lamp being his penis. Phil symbolically was gifted the D.

Some of this is a shit post, but love to hear people's thoughts and reactions to this vid.

Your second point, wow I'd never thought about that. Dan was so enamoured with Phil back then (low-key still is ) but I just find it adorable that he's kept it all these years, I lose presents so easily - but Dan managed to keep it after moving three times (Wokingham -> Manchester Uni -> Manchester Flat -> London Flat)

[saffarinda]

hey, this is pretty off topic to the convo that's been going on here - but i was wondering where the theories regarding dnp moving started from? i didn't really start to believe them until dans "relocating wirrow painting" in his lastest liveshow, but i'd seen mentions of it all over the place. was it just because of the talk of how noisy their apartment is, and how little storage space they have?

It was mentions of stress and exhaustion by Dan that really made people start talking.

Also, both Dan and Phil mentioned on several occasions that they needed additional #storage.

Ah, ty both of u!! At first I didn't like the idea that they were moving because I adore their flat with all it's little quirks, but if they can get a dog and we'd get a low-key confirmation that them living together isn't just a temporary thing then I'd love it

[onetruetrash]

hey, this is pretty off topic to the convo that's been going on here - but i was wondering where the theories regarding dnp moving started from? i didn't really start to believe them until dans "relocating wirrow painting" in his lastest liveshow, but i'd seen mentions of it all over the place. was it just because of the talk of how noisy their apartment is, and how little storage space they have?

It was mentions of stress and exhaustion by Dan that really made people start talking.

Also, both Dan and Phil mentioned on several occasions that they needed additional #storage.

Ah, ty both of u!! At first I didn't like the idea that they were moving because I adore their flat with all it's little quirks, but if they can get a dog and we'd get a low-key confirmation that them living together isn't just a temporary thing then I'd love it

I would lose my sanity if they moved into different places tho

[DatCog]

Wonder what video we'll get tonight...will it be another DAPG or a DINOF?? Maybe it'll be the hour-long Horse Prince finale!

Hope the guys are having a fun time wherever they are (still hoping they might have a few days in Japan )

[scientia]

Wonder what video we'll get tonight...will it be another DAPG or a DINOF?? Maybe it'll be the hour-long Horse Prince finale!

Hope the guys are having a fun time wherever they are (still hoping they might have a few days in Japan )

I've been wondering which video would be posted today too!

Do we know any more about their travel plans for the rest of the month? Is Phil going on vacation with his family to FL before playlist? I'm wondering if it will be another 2 weeks or so before we get back to regular live show schedules (in a new location??)

[MythicalPinkTrashCan]

Wonder what video we'll get tonight...will it be another DAPG or a DINOF?? Maybe it'll be the hour-long Horse Prince finale!

Hope the guys are having a fun time wherever they are (still hoping they might have a few days in Japan )

*prays to the youtube gods for Horse Prince*

[gnostic]

It was mentions of stress and exhaustion by Dan that really made people start talking.

Also, both Dan and Phil mentioned on several occasions that they needed additional #storage.

Ah, ty both of u!! At first I didn't like the idea that they were moving because I adore their flat with all it's little quirks, but if they can get a dog and we'd get a low-key confirmation that them living together isn't just a temporary thing then I'd love it

I would lose my sanity if they moved into different places tho

I do not believe Phan is real and even I concede they are not likely to move apart. Cause ain't no way these lazy ass motherfuckers will travel to each other's apartment to film DAPG or get someone else to help with the camera

Wonder what video we'll get tonight...will it be another DAPG or a DINOF?? Maybe it'll be the hour-long Horse Prince finale!

Hope the guys are having a fun time wherever they are (still hoping they might have a few days in Japan )

*prays to the youtube gods for Horse Prince*

Let me join you in this circle sister

[sugar]

Wonder what video we'll get tonight...will it be another DAPG or a DINOF?? Maybe it'll be the hour-long Horse Prince finale!

Hope the guys are having a fun time wherever they are (still hoping they might have a few days in Japan )

*prays to the youtube gods for Horse Prince*

Let me join you in this circle sister

same! i know some people hate the horse prince videos but i think they're hilarious and was also hoping that that would be today's video

[alittledizzy]

Add me to the list of people totally ready for that Horse Prince finale.

Also, the list of people ready to find out where deppy are headed next. The mystery is burning me.