Dan & Phil Part 46: Some kind of a gay backstory

[papierklemmen]

[offtopic]i've just spent an hour watching various videos with my 10 y.o niece and she likes them! her opinions are below the spoiler

on content: she thinks they're "kinda dumb" and that "dan is funnier, but phil is better for kids because he bleeps the swears and doesn't say dirty jokes." (we watched a couple collabs and the childhood videos, i forgot dan says some things in his)

on shipping: she noticed phil's eyebrows, asked if his hair is really black, and when i said it's kinda close to dan's color she asked if they're brothers. i told her they're best friends who live together, but some people think they might be dating (bc she was shooting me looks at every Love Eyes moment) and she said "that's dumb because its nobody's business if they don't say they are"

[/offtopic]

your niece rocks

[onetruetrash]

I loved the new video! They were acting so cute in that video, my tiny heart can't take it!

Also, I'm Team Beardroom. I have a tablet, so I can see closer into the picture. The walls seem extremely close to the bed. It looks like there's a shelf space on the right side of the 8-ball, a door on the left, and no windows. There's no way Phil sleeps in there every night.

[capybantsa]

Omg this video was so funny, I almost cried

Psychic stuff is absolutely real, Dan! Somebody should show him the CIA documents lol

I do tarot, and now I kinda wanna do a reading on D&P...
Anybody have any suggestions?


Also I'm lowkey starting to believe the theory that they've actually retired to Florida
I don't mind, tan!Dan will return to us and it will be beautiful

Okay, I'll try to explain things from my perspective. Please try to understand why somebody in my position might feel attacked, even if it wasn't your direct intention.


In my first post, I used soft opinion language for the most part:
"I think", "it's like", "to me", "consider".

I also used some strong opinion language:
"Really", "pretty likely", "much more likely", "I have no doubt".

A few instances of imploring language:
"Look at it this way", "have to consider", "should this not".

With exception to the final paragraph about the twins, I did not make any hard statements about my opinions and I did not use emotional or argumentative language. Every opinion used opinion language, and only objective facts were framed as hard statements. The tone was neutral.


I'm aware not all of the subsequent posts were in direct response to me, but they were part of the same conversation.

People used some soft opinion language:
"I think", "may be", "I guess", "seems", "I don't know".

Some strong opinion language:
"Clearly", "really, really", "definitely think", "as far as I'm concerned".

Assumptive language:
"Expect", "should be", "obviously".

A lot of emotional language:
"Fair/unfair", "feel", "awful", "shitty", "rubs me the wrong way", "sinister", "bullying", "backing them into a corner", "laughable", "bullshit", "actual human beings", "sensitive".

Argumentative language:
"Do you not understand", "how the fuck", "not at all relevant", "think about that".

Every single post used emotional language (though one was pretty mild and brought much more facts to the table than feels). With the exception of that one, every single post mixed opinion language with hard statements when presenting subjective opinions, and had either an upset or angry tone. Argumentative and angry emotional language were used directly toward me by one person and emphatically endorsed by another.

So how am I not supposed to feel attacked? With all the emotional and hard language, how am I not supposed to get the impression that most of you have a strong negative emotional response ("hate") to different opinions?


Maybe your intentions were harmless, but your actions were not.
Which, by the way, was my point about Shane that I expanded on in the second post. I believe his intentions are harmless, and I also believe that if D&P ask him directly to stop that he will. I respect if you disagree, it's just my honest opinion based on what I know about the situation.


Anyway I really don't want to argue. My only intention was to try to see things from Shane's perspective, because I do think it's not fair only to look at things from D&P's perspective, and then I got a little angry because people gave me the strong impression that it wasn't okay.

[autumnhearth]

Hi! this is my first post

I just wanted to say that I loved the video and it's one of my favorites from 2017 so far.

Also I got curious about what the cards says about the future so I google searched. If you believe tarot cards or phil's psychic powers this is interesting

The ace of wands (Dan's future): In the future position, this card indicates that a big break is ahead, but it is a blessing.

The ace of cups (Phil's future from his other video): The Ace of Cups in the future position indicates that you are pursuing love as a goal in this lifetime.

Also just bc curiosity this what the page says about the knight of wands:
The Knight in the future position is often likely to represent someone else, not you. This could represent a man coming into your life. The Knight of Wands represents other people who are charismatic, intelligent, or artistic; they have a flair for saying the right thing at the right time. This is the recipe for seduction. Be sure he is more than just a passion poet looking for the quick score, though. The speed represented by this card should manifest as both of you falling in love, not him quickly seducing you and moving on soon after.

This is too much demon phannie well bye

I'm removing the spoiler cut from your post because I didn't notice it until I went to quote you and your observations relate to mine. I watched this video for the third time today, this time with the husband after watching Robot Death Machine and Predicting My Future. My husband's eyes went so big at the Knight of Wands description, even though I had mentioned it to him before. I also love the "I'm gonna go change the world in ways you could not believe", it makes me emotional every time. Yes Phil, yes you will have.

The husband's observation was that the Ace of Cups is a feminine card related to fertility while the Ace of Wands is related to male creativity/virility. (He keeps pointing out little things in their videos that "prove" feminine/submissive Phil and masculine/dominant Dan. Sigh, whatever husband.) Still: Wands are connected to passion and fire whereas Cups are more about intuition and emotion (wands=phallic rods, cups=wombs)

Curious that Phil was willing to talk about his own fertility in his video, which came up in both the tarot and tea leaves, but they cut the family planning bit out of Dan's. Though to be fair Phil was joking about being pregnant and his fake wife Janice (did anyone else see the fake People magazine article with Janice, Phil and Dan the pool boy on Tumblr? So brilliant.), whereas thinking about starting a family is quite serious and would be hard to dismiss with humor, especially if they both want kids. (sorry, these don't seem to come off...)

Oh goodness that scripted theory Ashling Rae Wow. I'm not sold but I love it all the same.

captainspacecoat (well maybe not anymore) Good night!

[captainspacecoat]

Okay, I'll try to explain things from my perspective. Please try to understand why somebody in my position might feel attacked, even if it wasn't your direct intention.


In my first post, I used soft opinion language for the most part:
"I think", "it's like", "to me", "consider".

I also used some strong opinion language:
"Really", "pretty likely", "much more likely", "I have no doubt".

A few instances of imploring language:
"Look at it this way", "have to consider", "should this not".

With exception to the final paragraph about the twins, I did not make any hard statements about my opinions and I did not use emotional or argumentative language. Every opinion used opinion language, and only objective facts were framed as hard statements. The tone was neutral.


I'm aware not all of the subsequent posts were in direct response to me, but they were part of the same conversation.

People used some soft opinion language:
"I think", "may be", "I guess", "seems", "I don't know".

Some strong opinion language:
"Clearly", "really, really", "definitely think", "as far as I'm concerned".

Assumptive language:
"Expect", "should be", "obviously".

A lot of emotional language:
"Fair/unfair", "feel", "awful", "shitty", "rubs me the wrong way", "sinister", "bullying", "backing them into a corner", "laughable", "bullshit", "actual human beings", "sensitive".

Argumentative language:
"Do you not understand", "how the fuck", "not at all relevant", "think about that".

Every single post used emotional language (though one was pretty mild and brought much more facts to the table than feels). With the exception of that one, every single post mixed opinion language with hard statements when presenting subjective opinions, and had either an upset or angry tone. Argumentative and angry emotional language were used directly toward me by one person and emphatically endorsed by another.

So how am I not supposed to feel attacked? With all the emotional and hard language, how am I not supposed to get the impression that most of you have a strong negative emotional response ("hate") to different opinions?


Maybe your intentions were harmless, but your actions were not.
Which, by the way, was my point about Shane that I expanded on in the second post. I believe his intentions are harmless, and I also believe that if D&P ask him directly to stop that he will. I respect if you disagree, it's just my honest opinion based on what I know about the situation.


Anyway I really don't want to argue. My only intention was to try to see things from Shane's perspective, because I do think it's not fair only to look at things from D&P's perspective, and then I got a little angry because people gave me the strong impression that it wasn't okay.

I think I was one of the people who responded to your post - I'm really sorry that you felt attacked, that wasn't my intention but that doesn't change the fact that you felt uncomfortable, so I really sincerely apologise and hope you're okay You've definitely made me rethink some of my language choices - I must admit I've never thought deeply about how emotive my language is on this forum so thank you for highlighting that.

The reason I responded so vehemently was because what Shane and co did resonated with me personally. I'm a closeted person so for him to discuss something so personal entirely without dnp's consent to such a large audience, and to imply that dnp owe their audience an explanation or else their relationship comes down to manipulation, really angered me, and I still struggle to see how that could be defended. I stand by the fact that, regardless of Shane's intention, that is objectively bullying by my standards - it's one-sided, it's invasive, it's accusatory, and this is not the first time he's done something like this.

I guess I just feel that on a forum such as this it goes without saying that everyone's posts are opinion-based, and that people are going to react strongly when it comes to personal things such as sexuality. If people disagree with your post, they're entitled to respond to that and so long as their attacks against you aren't personal then I think it's to be expected. Opinions are just that - opinions. We all have the right to state our opinions, and that right must be respected, but our opinions themselves do not necessarily have to be respected.

Thank you so much pilotlight and autumnhearth

[nephilimcat]

Okay, I'll try to explain things from my perspective. Please try to understand why somebody in my position might feel attacked, even if it wasn't your direct intention.


In my first post, I used soft opinion language for the most part:
"I think", "it's like", "to me", "consider".

I also used some strong opinion language:
"Really", "pretty likely", "much more likely", "I have no doubt".

A few instances of imploring language:
"Look at it this way", "have to consider", "should this not".

With exception to the final paragraph about the twins, I did not make any hard statements about my opinions and I did not use emotional or argumentative language. Every opinion used opinion language, and only objective facts were framed as hard statements. The tone was neutral.


I'm aware not all of the subsequent posts were in direct response to me, but they were part of the same conversation.

People used some soft opinion language:
"I think", "may be", "I guess", "seems", "I don't know".

Some strong opinion language:
"Clearly", "really, really", "definitely think", "as far as I'm concerned".

Assumptive language:
"Expect", "should be", "obviously".

A lot of emotional language:
"Fair/unfair", "feel", "awful", "shitty", "rubs me the wrong way", "sinister", "bullying", "backing them into a corner", "laughable", "bullshit", "actual human beings", "sensitive".

Argumentative language:
"Do you not understand", "how the fuck", "not at all relevant", "think about that".

Every single post used emotional language (though one was pretty mild and brought much more facts to the table than feels). With the exception of that one, every single post mixed opinion language with hard statements when presenting subjective opinions, and had either an upset or angry tone. Argumentative and angry emotional language were used directly toward me by one person and emphatically endorsed by another.

So how am I not supposed to feel attacked? With all the emotional and hard language, how am I not supposed to get the impression that most of you have a strong negative emotional response ("hate") to different opinions?


Maybe your intentions were harmless, but your actions were not.
Which, by the way, was my point about Shane that I expanded on in the second post. I believe his intentions are harmless, and I also believe that if D&P ask him directly to stop that he will. I respect if you disagree, it's just my honest opinion based on what I know about the situation.


Anyway I really don't want to argue. My only intention was to try to see things from Shane's perspective, because I do think it's not fair only to look at things from D&P's perspective, and then I got a little angry because people gave me the strong impression that it wasn't okay.

I did not reply to your initial post but I understand why you felt attacked. It's difficult to read posts online because you don't see the people or listen to their voices, so it's easy to interpret something as an attack that you might not have interpreted that way if you talked to that person directly. It also has its perks because people have to write out what they feel and can't blurt out something immediately, so opinions are often (not always) more thought out than in real life discussions. And it surely isn't a nice feeling when you're the only one who voices a different opinion and everyone reacts strongly to it. However, saying Westerners hate different opinions just because people disagree with you, also isn't the way to go about it, in my opinion, and comes across as really defensive and like people are not allowed to disagree with you.

I also understand why you would want to look at the whole thing from Shane's perspective. It is important to consider all perspectives and reasonings, that's true. I don't know him and only read the transcript, so there's no way I would know whether he actually meant any harm by it or not (and nobody but Shane knows that). But even if he didn't mean any harm, it doesn't excuse his behaviour. Which btw, is exactly what you told the people who replied to your post:

Maybe your intentions were harmless, but your actions were not.

So you do know that intentions aren't an excuse for bad behaviour. Even if he didn't intend anything bad, it still wasn't the right thing to do. Discussing your peers' private lives and/or using them for views is not okay. If he didn't mean any harm, he could apologise or at least stop doing stuff like that in the future. That wouldn't undo what he did but it certainly would show that he's a decent person after all. However, I personally get the impression that he just doesn't care, but of course that's just my interpretation without even knowing him

Also, captainspacecoat, I really liked your response

[phanofcats]

Okay, so I'm also not a huge believer in this sort of thing, but this has me really thrown. Or it did, until I realized..

What if we, only the die-hard fans, are meant to snoop into this? They know we will. They know we theorize, and we will believe anything that says they'll be together. And now we know that they (or, Dan at least) have sprinkled in hints about big life decisions that only the true trashcans (and therefore the people most affected by it) would notice. So here's my theory.. This video is scripted. They know which card is coming, in fact they chose them specifically for their meaning, which they never mention overtly, knowing some of us will dig for it.

And that's why the first two were so eerily accurate too. To really make us buy the last part.

Maybe they're hinting at a whole new level of "life thing".

Oh wow, this theory has my mind going! It definitely could be a possibility I'm leaning more towards a crazy coincidence (I'm not one to belive in psychic stuff). It would be pretty wild if they did plan it, they know that we would look into a lot more. Leaving the family part out because it's kind of hard to explain away, especially if they both want kids soon. They did say 2017 was going to be full of "life things"! That still gets my demon heart racing

I did see a bit of a crazy theory someone said on twitter about "that week in March" relating to the family thing. What if that week they were starting to go through the adoption process with all the paperwork and all that? Apparently it takes 5-12 months to be matched up with a child! "Ask me about it in 5 months time." It is a bit wild and out there, but I still don't know what to think about what was happening in March. I honestly think it had to do with trying to buy a house/ rent a different apartment but they didn't get it.

This was all actually a secret message from dnp to the Psychic Twins to reaffirm they don't want to go on their channel and they're coming for their branding
The Psychic Twins are shook!!!

This had me cracking up It was a message for them to back the fuck up!

[LtrllySusan]

A lot of the baby/adoption talk might be for the LOLs, but do you guys actually see them adopting a baby in the near future?

Phan theories and cute Dad fanfictions aside, would they - at their current age and stage in life - be ready to raise a child? I just can't see that yet, tbh. As cute as it would be.
IMO, I think at their current state they are still figuring out their relationship/the display of it and the relationship they have to their viewers. I think theories related to housing issues are more relatistic regarding "that week".

[flarequake]

I think a child is still a way in the future, if at all to be realistic just since we don't know that's on their minds really. Dan is only 25 and they've only just got into their new place after settling back into normal life after the tour.

[fancybum]

Okay, I'll try to explain things from my perspective. Please try to understand why somebody in my position might feel attacked, even if it wasn't your direct intention.


In my first post, I used soft opinion language for the most part:
"I think", "it's like", "to me", "consider".

I also used some strong opinion language:
"Really", "pretty likely", "much more likely", "I have no doubt".

A few instances of imploring language:
"Look at it this way", "have to consider", "should this not".

With exception to the final paragraph about the twins, I did not make any hard statements about my opinions and I did not use emotional or argumentative language. Every opinion used opinion language, and only objective facts were framed as hard statements. The tone was neutral.


I'm aware not all of the subsequent posts were in direct response to me, but they were part of the same conversation.

People used some soft opinion language:
"I think", "may be", "I guess", "seems", "I don't know".

Some strong opinion language:
"Clearly", "really, really", "definitely think", "as far as I'm concerned".

Assumptive language:
"Expect", "should be", "obviously".

A lot of emotional language:
"Fair/unfair", "feel", "awful", "shitty", "rubs me the wrong way", "sinister", "bullying", "backing them into a corner", "laughable", "bullshit", "actual human beings", "sensitive".

Argumentative language:
"Do you not understand", "how the fuck", "not at all relevant", "think about that".

Every single post used emotional language (though one was pretty mild and brought much more facts to the table than feels). With the exception of that one, every single post mixed opinion language with hard statements when presenting subjective opinions, and had either an upset or angry tone. Argumentative and angry emotional language were used directly toward me by one person and emphatically endorsed by another.

So how am I not supposed to feel attacked? With all the emotional and hard language, how am I not supposed to get the impression that most of you have a strong negative emotional response ("hate") to different opinions?


Maybe your intentions were harmless, but your actions were not.
Which, by the way, was my point about Shane that I expanded on in the second post. I believe his intentions are harmless, and I also believe that if D&P ask him directly to stop that he will. I respect if you disagree, it's just my honest opinion based on what I know about the situation.


Anyway I really don't want to argue. My only intention was to try to see things from Shane's perspective, because I do think it's not fair only to look at things from D&P's perspective, and then I got a little angry because people gave me the strong impression that it wasn't okay.

I didn't realize the entire internet was just a technical writing course where emotions have no place. This forum isn't compiling a technical manual, it's an ongoing casual discussion (or thought-dumping ground) centred around two strangers and the way in which they and their lives (or perceptions of their lives) relate back to us. Nothing exists in a vacuum, Shane's words and intent don't exist in a vacuum; he's just talking about D&P on one level, on another he's talking about the sexualities and personal details of people who don't want to explicitly share certain parts of themselves (and have made that quite clear). Shane ignoring that boundary on a public platform, that's going to hit some nerves. In case you needed an explanation of why people might be bringing emotions to the table in response.

Language is an art, communication is an art, emotions belong in art. Just to be safe though, imagine a big sign over everything written here flashing the words: In My Opinion, This Is My Perspective From My Own Brain. And maybe another one saying Passion Doesn't Equal Fact, just so I'm really covered. I'm not going to apologize for passionate language being used to express passionate ideas or for the use of swearing as punctuation. It's unfortunate you think of these things as attacks on you personally rather than engaging in disagreement over ideas (or just the presentation of ideas. I'm genuinely asking you here why do I "have to consider" anything about Tyler Oakley in a discussion about Shane Dawson? What was the intent there? Beep boop, question sent).

[JustMe]

Anyone else totally miss that they (sort of) held hands for a second in the new video??:
[tumblr] <div class="tumblr-post" data-href="https://embed.tumblr.com/embed/post/y9z ... 0904816093" data-did="da39a3ee5e6b4b0d3255bfef95601890afd80709">[/tumblr]

Also, I love the face Dan makes after Phil's pranked him. To me it's along the lines of 'I can't believe you did that but you're cute so I'm not mad'
[tumblr] <div class="tumblr-post" data-href="https://embed.tumblr.com/embed/post/aiJ ... 0903881664" data-did="3c2e4ba6968e5439b5bac9a35ae579380a6486d3">[/tumblr]

[onetruetrash]

As cute as it would be, I don't think they are ready to raise a child. Dan's only 25-going-on-26 and he only really grew up within the last 6 months or so. (at least to me anyways) Don't get me wrong, them adopting would be the cutest thing ever, but Dan's still quite young to have a child.

Then again, my mom had me when she was 24 and my teacher, who is younger than Dan by 3 months, has a wife and kid. Who even knows?

[Ilovethemohyesido]

Also, I love the face Dan makes after Phil's pranked him. To me it's along the lines of 'I can't believe you did that but you're cute so I'm not mad'
[tumblr] <div class="tumblr-post" data-href="https://embed.tumblr.com/embed/post/aiJ ... 0903881664" data-did="3c2e4ba6968e5439b5bac9a35ae579380a6486d3">[/tumblr]

[saffarinda]

I don't think any babies/marriage is on the horizon, I just enjoy joking about it tbh (dog first, everything else later). They still have their entire youtube careers, babies + travelling constantly is not the best idea

Btw: Are they still in Florida? Because if that video was pre-recorded too I'm defo thinking Bahamas was for a project - leaning towards that film theory.

[lost686girl]

As cute as it would be, I don't think they are ready to raise a child. Dan's only 25-going-on-26 and he only really grew up within the last 6 months or so. (at least to me anyways) Don't get me wrong, them adopting would be the cutest thing ever, but Dan's still quite young to have a child.

Then again, my mom had me when she was 24 and my teacher, who is younger than Dan by 3 months, has a wife and kid. Who even knows?

I think In like 5 years they will start to think about that seriously. 30 and 35 are pretty great ages for baby-making lol. But who am I to say, I'm dans age and I want a baby RIGHT NOW GIVE IT TO ME

[captainspacecoat]

Btw: Are they still in Florida? Because if that video was pre-recorded too I'm defo thinking Bahamas was for a project - leaning towards that film theory.

I think they're still there, at least judging by Martyn's instagram yesterday which had Dan in the background. It feels like they've been in Florida for sooooo long, surely they'll fly home within the next few days!

I'm not sure that the number of pre-recorded videos necessarily indicates Dan was planning on staying in Florida with the Lesters - they would have to be pre-recorded even if Dan had intended to go home early because Phil himself would be in Florida and they'd still need to upload content while the two of them were in different countries. If Dan uploads a pre-recorded solo vid for his channel then maybe that would suggest he was planning on staying, but otherwise I don't think it means anything either way. Not saying he definitely planned on staying, or that the Bahamas wasn't for a secret project, though - you may very well be right!

Also, completely agree re: babies - I definitely don't think they're planning on having kids any time soon.

[apathy]

Marriage & children in your early 20s is very common in my area (to the point that 30 & single is "old maid" status). But Dan has said his parents were "quite young" when they had him and someone here once said/speculated that they were in their early 30s. I believe he also once said something about not having kids until you're ready to be the best parent ever. So I'd expect that's still several years away in his mind.

[autumnhearth]

Five years seems about right to me too (though they could even wait ten as it is not dependent on their biological clocks). They might both be emotionally ready now, but I don't think they are ready at this point in their careers (if they want babies at all, mind). It's funny, I became a mum at 23 and it worked out very well for me (I've always been emotionally mature for my age) but could you imagine Phil being a dad at 23? "Does she want to give me the babies?" Nope, nope, nopity nope.

[anonymousdork]

Hi! First time poster here! I just came to say that I am overwhelmed with feelings about the AP video - it was beautiful and Phil as a prank king is my new favorite trope.

Also that bedroom is 100% a set. I have no doubt.

[SquishPhan]

Seems like they are still in Florida. Wonder when they are going home.

[adequate duck]

i didn't have my son until i was (just about to turn) 40, so to me they still have so many years left before they need to think about kids. it's perfectly possible to be good parents at 25 and 30 (or indeed even younger), but it's not necessary. i mean sure if they are together (which i do believe) and they want kids right now then they should, but they surely do not seem (to me) like they are in the right place for it right now.

25 and 30 seem impossibly old and mature and adult to many of you who are younger than that, but as someone who is old enough to be the parent of people who were complaining about being too old for phandom, they're still young - they could wait 10 or 15 or 20 years and still be young and energetic enough to raise a child.

[malday]

Seems like they are still in Florida. Wonder when they are going home.

wonder when they'll run out of pre-recorded videos and have to film one there.

[phanofcats]

I don't believe they are ready for kids yet either (it was just a theory I had heard ahah). It seems as if they are just now starting to settle down in 2017, relaxing after tour and the moving out. Marriage I can honestly see happening anytime now but children I give another 5 years. They just don't seem ready for that yet, they need to buy a house and get a dog first!

[lefthandedism]

Hello and anonymousdork!

As many have pointed out, there are lots of reasons that Deppy are not yet at an optimal stage to become parents--plenty of things to do and experience and get sorted first! And there's really plenty of time. They won't be "old" parents for at least another 15 years.

And the nice thing for them is that as a m/m couple they have no worries about parenthood sneaking up on them. The flip side of that of course is that they have to be very deliberative about becoming parents. I'll point out again that adoption is not the only option, and adoption is not for everyone. Deciding what it means to become a parent, for you and for your partner, is an intensely personal decision (when it doesn't "happen" "naturally"). For example, I know a lot of people who would never ever adopt, because of their own experience as an adopted person or with an adopted family member. Other people only want a child if it's genetically related to their partner. Some people don't want a child who is genetically related to themselves.

While I endorse all the pheels , when people say "they should/will/are about to adopt a child!", it sounds too much to me like "adopt a puppy!", without acknowledging either the existence of other family-building options or the complicated emotional decision-making that goes into deciding to adopt (or start a family another way), which is definitely a forever decision.

[karma_yeah]

i didn't have my son until i was (just about to turn) 40, so to me they still have so many years left before they need to think about kids. it's perfectly possible to be good parents at 25 and 30 (or indeed even younger), but it's not necessary. i mean sure if they are together (which i do believe) and they want kids right now then they should, but they surely do not seem (to me) like they are in the right place for it right now.

25 and 30 seem impossibly old and mature and adult to many of you who are younger than that, but as someone who is old enough to be the parent of people who were complaining about being too old for phandom, they're still young - they could wait 10 or 15 or 20 years and still be young and energetic enough to raise a child.

As someone even older (probably), I whole-heartedly agree! My biological clock didn't go off until I was 30, (but when it went off it was more like a time bomb -- 'must have child NOW').

Granted, Phil is 30, but Dan is only 25, and may not be ready. Couple that with the fact that they aren't in their "forever home" (pun intended), and it's probably not quite the right time.

Also, I'd really like to see what direction their careers head in next. They had such a burst of creativity with the release of TABINOFF and TATINOFF that led to a lot of travel for them, so maybe they want to stabilize their careers first.

I wonder if they would feel fulfilled enough if they just made youtube videos and ran their merch shop? Is that a sustainable livelihood? Will viewers slowly age-out resulting in a decline in income? It certainly seems like they have been careful with their money and have probably made sound financial decisions, but there's no way to know how much they really made with TABINOFF and TATINOFF after expenses, or continue to make with merch.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love a baby , but for me, it seems too early.