Dan & Phil Part 36: Wholesome Howell and AmazingPhlegm

[papierklemmen]

i don't really get the "it's weird/it makes me uncomfortable" comments tbh. dan's been making fun of the phandom's obsession with "domestic moments" for ages now, it's nothing new (in a way he "reclaimed" it and started using it himself, but with an obvious jokey tone). he mocked the "heart eyes howell" thing in the past. now he acknowledged that people put too much emphasize on his "we". the buddy buddy stuff is the same. he's taking the piss, that's all, as catallena said he's just not going the 2012 route and instead being lowkey passive aggressive which is smart and understandable tbh. i also think that all the "get a dog" acknowledgment is also a form of gently mockery. he knows you can't fight it, so why even try, just laugh along.

it's cool that he's now going to be uploading ls on his side channel, did he say that phil is going to be doing the same? i'm a bit over watching their ls these days, but maybe i'll check them out occasionally on yt.

[Truth_or_cliche]

i don't really get the "it's weird/it makes me uncomfortable" comments tbh. dan's been making fun of the phandom's obsession with "domestic moments" for ages now, it's nothing new (in a way he "reclaimed" it and started using it himself, but with an obvious jokey tone). he mocked the "heart eyes howell" thing in the past. now he acknowledged that people put too much emphasize on his "we". the buddy buddy stuff is the same. he's taking the piss, that's all, as catallena said he's just not going the 2012 route and instead being lowkey passive aggressive which is smart and understandable tbh. i also think that all the "get a dog" acknowledgment is also a form of gently mockery. he knows you can't fight it, so why even try, just laugh along.

it's cool that he's now going to be uploading ls on his side channel, did he say that phil is going to be doing the same? i'm a bit over watching their ls these days, but maybe i'll check them out occasionally on yt.

Eh you're right. I just never knew what exactly , if anything, he was mocking, but this makes sense.

[lerien]

There was nothing explanatory in Dan's tone at the 'domestic vibes', 'bestest buddy' and 'by we i mean me and phil' parts imo. Nothing. It's the same tone he uses when he's pissy about something but doesn't wanna or can't say it so he goes the passive aggressive route where he just takes the piss but won't get called out for it a la 2012 because he wasn't actually rude. Smart boy tbh.

Maybe YouTube or YouNow "asked" them to be mindful of new viewers and it annoyed him for some reason. I didn't see the live show but I know exactly the tone you're talking about. I've also noticed the tone whenever he calls Phil a synonym for friend (e.g. matey, bro, etc). It's almost like he's mocking his friendship with Phil...but why would he do that? Or maybe he's mocking those of us who care so much about the nature of their relationship. It feels like he's mocking something. Idk what it is but it is definitely weird and makes me do a double take.

Tbh I don't think it's really mocking, he might just be embarrassed to admit such a closeness to a bunch of (however well-attentioned) strangers. Plus he's really (and that's not news to me) self-conscious about how we view his relationship with Phil and how much we care and that makes him even more embarrassed and maybe even a tiny bit resentful. So he tries to brush it off like a joke, which seems to be a recurring copying mecanism due to embarrassment with him. It bothers me for some reasons, it feels so forced and unatural but I don't think he's condescending/mocking on purpose.

EDIT: When I say that he brushes it off as a joke, he's basically just taking the piss and his resentment makes it a tad passive aggressive. Annoying but still better than 2012.

[MoonPride]

I thought the whole best buddy thing was him being sarcastic and taking the piss. I'm not going to read much into it.

[papierklemmen]

What I find weird is people policing how Dan should or should not be addressing his friendship with Phil in front of strangers on the Internet. I think if someone is bothered or annoyed by Dan's sarcastic jokes about domestic buddy stuff, then IDK maybe it's about you and your expectations, and not about Dan? Should he be "soft" and "fond" and lovingly call Phil his "bae" for his viewers' entertainment? He's already mentioning Phil about a thousand times per LS. I know some people can't wait for the day they start vlogging about their dogs and children and being all lovey dovey, but lbr it's not how Deppy roll - at least for now.

[lerien]

What I find weird is people policing how Dan should or should not be addressing his friendship with Phil in front of strangers on the Internet. I think if someone is bothered or annoyed by Dan's sarcastic jokes about domestic buddy stuff, then IDK maybe it's about you and your expectations, and not about Dan? Should he be "soft" and "fond" and lovingly call Phil his "bae" for his viewers' entertainment? He's already mentioning Phil about a thousand times per LS. I know some people can't wait for the day they start vlogging about their dogs and children, but lbr it's not how Deppy roll - at least for now.

I understand what you're saying but personnally, it isn't what is annoying me, it just feels like he doesn't want to talk about the subject at all and well, he could do just that. There's also second-hand embarrassement for his behalf I suppose, idk. Anyway, in a viewer's perspective, I got the feeling he's using sarcasm to protect himself if it makes sense but it makes him look like really defensive towards his audience. Idk, it's just a feeling I have and it's very possible it's just that I don't like this kind of humour I'm not pretending to be a totally objective viewer

[Truth_or_cliche]

Maybe YouTube or YouNow "asked" them to be mindful of new viewers and it annoyed him for some reason

This does not make sense. Deppy decide what their own content will be and put it on Youtube and Younow. If they censor themselves it is because they want to. Youtube and Younow change or remove content only for breaking rules like no nudity. It is not a dictatorship.

I wasn't implying that they don't have creative control over their content, but they do technically work for these companies (well actually idk if they get paid for YouNow) it's not far fetched to assume that they get asked to do things that they don't really want to do, but they do it anyway because it's their job.

Tbh I don't think it's really mocking, he might just be embarrassed to admit such a closeness to a bunch of (however well-attentioned) strangers. Plus he's really (and that's not news to me) self-conscious about how we view his relationship with Phil and how much we care and that makes him even more embarrassed and maybe even a tiny bit resentful. So he tries to brush it off like a joke, which seems to be a recurring copying mecanism due to embarrassment with him. It bothers me for some reasons, it feels so forced and unatural but I don't think he's condescending/mocking on purpose.

EDIT: When I say that he brushes it off as a joke, he's basically just taking the piss and his resentment makes it a tad passive aggressive. Annoying but still better than 2012.

Hmmm...also possible. It just seems like mockery to me, but interesting take on it.

[spider]

I wasn't implying that they don't have creative control over their content, but they do technically work for these companies (well actually idk if they get paid for YouNow) it's not far fetched to assume that they get asked to do things that they don't really want to do, but they do it anyway because it's their job.

It is their job like you said. They get paid for Younow. Deppy are not employees of Youtube or Younow. They are partners. They put their content on the sites and split the earnings from ads and paid content.

If you don't understand think of it differently. Why would Youtube or Younow want a popular ship to act more platonic? More views get more money. That is why clickbait is a lot of Youtube content now. If Deppy implied they are a couple in a video that is double or triple views. If Deppy came out it would be top trending. There is no business logic for Deppy to act platonic. Many people even think they are ship baiting or queerbaiting for more views. They are wrong but it is more logical for business. Especially Youtube or Younow would not tell them to act like friends more.

Does anyone have an opinion for Spring 2017? Another Japhan or engagement or moving? A dog? Maybe all of them?

[papierklemmen]

Does anyone have an opinion for Spring 2017? Another Japhan or engagement or moving? A dog? Maybe all of them?

calling it: their neighbour's dog will get engaged and move to japan

[MoonPride]

My Spring 2017 prediction is moving out, I think if they went Japan they may want to do another season instead of Spring again.

[DryCereal]

I think the "explanation overload" last night was probably just geared towards people who might now only find out he's been doing LSs for the past 4.5 years now one's popped up on DINI.

Yes boys, get that adsense money too!!

Interested to see if they do online hosting for the Brits again this year... Nominations are this week, then the awards show on the 22/2/17.

[lurker]

re: the fish thing, i personally didn't even pick up on it before i came here, it seemed to make perfectly sense at the time in the literal way. i understood it to mean something along the lines of "fish is my to-go answer for my most hated food, but now that i'm thinking about it, it's not like anyone's been forcing me to have it since i moved out/quit uni which has been literal years, so i don't have strong feelings about it anymore". of course, that's an interpretation as well, but just to add to the ones that already came up, i do think it's plausible that in this case, the fish is simply a fish. (of course, the fish is a weird way to phrase it, which is probably why everyone picked up on it? but it could just be word vomit, plus he was mumbling.)

and yeah the comment was crude and kinda gross if he was talking about vagina, but also in this same liveshow, dan referred to cigarettes as f*gs so it's not like he's not prone to this kind of offensive language

wait, what? i certainly did not hear that. can anyone direct me to where he said that?

re: the word 'phan' being banned in the chat -- i tried to look into that as well, and from all i could gather from people complaining about being banned on message boards and/or reddit, if someone used a word that was banned by the chat guidelines, they would receive a notification/warning and possibly have their account deleted. so i assume that if there was a way for broadcasters to ban certain words, it would result in a similar procedure, i.e. chat users would get a notification rather than just be logged off.

re: dan calling phil his 'bestest of buddies' -- just to add to the wide range of personal opinions, to me it didn't feel weird or uncomfortable at all. with so many people digging to find out about the exact nature of their relationship, it could just be that he doesn't feel like specifying in a sincere tone anymore in general, so it might be a tongue-in-cheek way to say 'whatever i'm saying now, y'all gonna analyze it anyway', or to make it deliberately impossible to draw conclusions (should the phrase be taken literally? did he make it sound ironic on purpose?). i certainly did not feel like he was mocking his relationship with phil, seeing that the thing he said directly afterwards was "he knows me very well".

[DryCereal]

and yeah the comment was crude and kinda gross if he was talking about vagina, but also in this same liveshow, dan referred to cigarettes as f*gs so it's not like he's not prone to this kind of offensive language

And what, pray tell, is offensive about referring to deathsticks as fags? Yes, if he was talking about a person and describing them by their sexuality that would be highly inappropriate, but I'm not about to get offended on behalf of inanimate objects.
But if you are, I suggest you don't go looking for what meatballs in gravy are commonly called in S. England...

"Fish" comment - cheeky bit of double-entendre that made me giggle.

"Best buddies" - remember the confused reaction when they made Dil & Tabitha best friends and it changed the nature of their relationship? Keep that in mind too as well as the constant ambiguity they've been throwing around more than my local council's been slinging grit...!

[majitzu]

Fags is how people call the cigarettes in the UK, there is not deeper meaning. Unless you wanna get angry with Dan because he obvs know what they mean in america

[silverwinter]

and yeah the comment was crude and kinda gross if he was talking about vagina, but also in this same liveshow, dan referred to cigarettes as f*gs so it's not like he's not prone to this kind of offensive language

wait, what? i certainly did not hear that. can anyone direct me to where he said that?

at around 7:31 in the liveshow

and IckleMissMayhem, i understand that word has a different connotation in england, but when someone says that word to an audience of thousands of non-english teenagers, it gets kinda iffy. esp bc a ton of kids in the chat didn't know what he actually meant when he was talking about it. poor choice of words imo

[captainspacecoat]

and yeah the comment was crude and kinda gross if he was talking about vagina, but also in this same liveshow, dan referred to cigarettes as f*gs so it's not like he's not prone to this kind of offensive language

wait, what? i certainly did not hear that. can anyone direct me to where he said that?

at around 7:31 in the liveshow

and IckleMissMayhem, i understand that word has a different connotation in england, but when someone says that word to an audience of thousands of non-english teenagers, it gets kinda iffy. esp bc a ton of kids in the chat didn't know what he actually meant when he was talking about it. poor choice of words imo

i feel like that's a bit unfair on dan tbh, like i totally understand how people from america/maybe some other countries were taken aback by it, but it literally isn't offensive in that context in the uk so he probably didn't think that deeply about it. i'm from australia, where f*g is often used to refer to cigarettes, and literally no one would be offended by that. if used as a (horrifically offensive and inexcusable) slur against gay/bi men, then i would be 100% offended but you can't expect dan to remember that it doesn't mean cigarette in the US. seems kind of US-centric and unrealistic tbh.

[papierklemmen]

oh here we go... i'm sure their audience is aware that they're watching a liveshow of a UK citizen, he doesn't have to be neutralizing his language for the rest of the world when talking about cigarettes.

[silverwinter]

and yeah the comment was crude and kinda gross if he was talking about vagina, but also in this same liveshow, dan referred to cigarettes as f*gs so it's not like he's not prone to this kind of offensive language

wait, what? i certainly did not hear that. can anyone direct me to where he said that?

at around 7:31 in the liveshow

and IckleMissMayhem, i understand that word has a different connotation in england, but when someone says that word to an audience of thousands of non-english teenagers, it gets kinda iffy. esp bc a ton of kids in the chat didn't know what he actually meant when he was talking about it. poor choice of words imo

i feel like that's a bit unfair on dan tbh, like i totally understand how people from america/maybe some other countries were taken aback by it, but it literally isn't offensive in that context in the uk so he probably didn't think that deeply about it. i'm from australia, where f*g is often used to refer to cigarettes, and literally no one would be offended by that. if used as a (horrifically offensive and inexcusable) slur against gay/bi men, then i would be 100% offended but you can't expect dan to remember that it doesn't mean cigarette in the US. seems kind of US-centric and unrealistic tbh.

okay. and for the record, while i specifically knew what he was talking about and i specifically wasn't offended by his words, tons of queer american (or from anywhere else) kids watching that liveshow could have been. he didn't bother to elaborate at all to make sure people knew what he really meant, and i think that as an entertainer, he needs to be aware of his words and of who his audience is

[papierklemmen]

okay. and for the record, while i specifically knew what he was talking about and i specifically wasn't offended by his words, tons of queer american (or from anywhere else) kids watching that liveshow could have been. he didn't bother to elaborate at all to make sure people knew what he really meant, and i think that as an entertainer, he needs to be aware of his words and of who his audience is

not to start a language wank, but your post is a bit ironic since quite a number of (gay, bi and even straight) people here in idb also expressed that they're uncomfortable with the word "queer" being used when referring to lgbt community, because somewhere it's still considered a slur.

[captainspacecoat]

okay. and for the record, while i specifically knew what he was talking about and i specifically wasn't offended by his words, tons of queer american (or from anywhere else) kids watching that liveshow could have been. he didn't bother to elaborate at all to make sure people knew what he really meant, and i think that as an entertainer, he needs to be aware of his words and of who his audience is

i understand that, and that's fair enough. but i maintain that i don't think it's fair to expect dan to have thought of that in the context of a liveshow, where it's completely unscripted and he's just speaking off the top of his head. i also think that we should give dan more credit, i think it's fair to say he's made an effort in the past year or two to assert that he experiences attraction to guys, why would he make a homophobic slur? i agree that he has a responsibility to be aware of his words and who his audience is, but i'm still failing to see how he said anything wrong in this situation.

[nephilimcat]

and yeah the comment was crude and kinda gross if he was talking about vagina, but also in this same liveshow, dan referred to cigarettes as f*gs so it's not like he's not prone to this kind of offensive language

wait, what? i certainly did not hear that. can anyone direct me to where he said that?

at around 7:31 in the liveshow

and IckleMissMayhem, i understand that word has a different connotation in england, but when someone says that word to an audience of thousands of non-english teenagers, it gets kinda iffy. esp bc a ton of kids in the chat didn't know what he actually meant when he was talking about it. poor choice of words imo

i feel like that's a bit unfair on dan tbh, like i totally understand how people from america/maybe some other countries were taken aback by it, but it literally isn't offensive in that context in the uk so he probably didn't think that deeply about it. i'm from australia, where f*g is often used to refer to cigarettes, and literally no one would be offended by that. if used as a (horrifically offensive and inexcusable) slur against gay/bi men, then i would be 100% offended but you can't expect dan to remember that it doesn't mean cigarette in the US. seems kind of US-centric and unrealistic tbh.

okay. and for the record, while i specifically knew what he was talking about and i specifically wasn't offended by his words, tons of queer american (or from anywhere else) kids watching that liveshow could have been. he didn't bother to elaborate at all to make sure people knew what he really meant, and i think that as an entertainer, he needs to be aware of his words and of who his audience is

If you are having a ls, you can't think about every single word and whether it could be possibly seen as offensive by people who are from America, Australia or not even English speaking countries. Besides, maybe Dan isn't even aware that calling cigarettes fags is a British thing. He probably is, but who knows? He is British and he can talk like a British guy. Americans should be able to figure out what he means. I managed to do that as well when I came across the word fag for the first time and I'm from Germany. It's not that hard, there's a thing called Google. People who watch him will know Dan better than assuming he is using slurs. Especially in that context, why would he say it like that? It's obvious he was talking about cigarettes. Should be very easy to understand.

[lurker]

thank you silverwinter for directing me to that part. in case anyone else is interested, the exact quote is

Anyway, so yeah it's a good thing neither of us decided to just, like -- blunt up a fag in the hallway, am I right Brits?

i personally didn't know that this word could be used to mean cigarette, but i didn't even pick up on it because it was obvious from context what it meant. if it had been ambiguous to me in any way, i certainly would have noticed as i would have been shocked. i also think it's possible he added the "am i right brits" to point out he was using the word in the british sense. i do agree that it was not the most sensible choice of words but from my personal point of view, it was not necessary to directly address it.

a completely different thing i remembered this morning was the bit where dan was talking about loving collectibles and how that was why he told phil they had to make dapgo. i found it interesting that that bit made it seem like he had to convince phil to do it. i've seen people discussing if phil's the "mastermind" behind their releases, does anyone have any thoughts on that?

[silverwinter]

okay. and for the record, while i specifically knew what he was talking about and i specifically wasn't offended by his words, tons of queer american (or from anywhere else) kids watching that liveshow could have been. he didn't bother to elaborate at all to make sure people knew what he really meant, and i think that as an entertainer, he needs to be aware of his words and of who his audience is

not to start a language wank, but your post is a bit ironic since quite a number of (gay, bi and even straight) people here in idb also expressed that they're uncomfortable with the word "queer" being used when referring to lgbt community, because somewhere it's still considered a slur.

the reason i use the word queer and not that other one is bc the former is a commonly reclaimed word in the community that most people who are online a lot are aware of it. if dan said that word, everyone would know what he was referring to. that other word is still considered a derogatory slur in most places, has not been reclaimed, and non-english people aren't necessarily aware that it can be used in a different sense.

again, all i'm saying is that dan should've been more conscious of what he was saying as someone with a young audience

and captainspacegoat yeah i basically don't disagree with you there. i'm not saying that anyone should attack dan or anything, i don't think he did anything immensely wrong, and his not being straight is definitely a good thing to keep in mind with all this. my point is that he said something thoughtless and that he needs to be more conscious in the future

[DryCereal]

a completely different thing i remembered this morning was the bit where dan was talking about loving collectibles and how that was why he told phil they had to make dapgo. i found it interesting that that bit made it seem like he had to convince phil to do it. i've seen people discussing if phil's the "mastermind" behind their releases, does anyone have any thoughts on that?

They're two people working together. Stands to reason that when one of them comes up with an idea, or wants to embark on a particular project they'd discuss it... Not necessarily "convince/persuade" - I don't think either of them would want to do something that the other wasn't 100% behind, but I do think they do have business/work discussions between the two of them.

[silverwinter]

also sorry to double post, but after the fish/vegan discussion of last night, i decided to go through his twitter to note any mention of his food choices since november lol. and...it really does seem more likely that he's vegetarian after going through that. his comments about food were all meat-free which, combined with the other sources people linked in previous posts, definitely seems like he's going steady with the vegetarian thing.

i don't know if he's just good at being subtle with his vegetarianism or if i'm just dense but i definitely wouldn't have noticed it until we had this discussion about it