Dan & Phil Part 54: Born in the fires of the internet

[liola]

Interesting, wonder if he'll mention it later! Alice Levine co-presents Phil's (and my) favourite podcast 'My Dad Wrote a Porno'

Oh, i didn't know that!

Indeed! I've been listening to it for ages, well before Phil said that he'd listened while on the treadmill, and now I can't help think about Phil listening when there's a particularly graphic or badly written sex scene and it makes me cringe a bit . I'd love for him to talk about it more on a liveshow but I don't suppose he will any time soon.

Edited to add: I'd really love to know if Dan is a fan of the podcast too and if so, whether he chatted about it with Alice backstage

I had this amazing mental pic in my head about Dan finding out she's the co-host of the podcast and telling her all dimpled smile that Phil loves it

Any guess about what game they're gonna play tonight? I was thinking maybe a Crash level, one of them can play while the other reads the chat. I don't think they'll play a 2 people game if they want to interact with viewers.

[Offtopic]I would love for Dan to do a video on mental health but I, too, am concerned about what his take on it would be.
I'm afraid he'd use the relatable black tumblr humor and while I appreciate it in most cases, I think this is one of the topic where he should be extra careful. Too many people don't really understand mental illness and treat it in a careless way.
I would love to hear him talk about his own experience and if he found difficult to seek help - I know that, for example,
I only recently started speaking up and seeking professional help after years of brushing the problem under a rug because I was scared it would be all in my head. It would be interesting to see a perspective of someone that has a lot of visibility and maybe feels like he can't really have much privacy on it.

I think if he gives a serious take on it, it would be extremely helpful. I remember when I first started watching youtube and I was coming to term with having a problem, hearing Zoella talk about her anxiety was grounding for me - that even someone that had her life kinda going into the right direction could suffer from a mental illness and she didn't seem ashamed of it. I don't necessarily want him to go into details, but I'd love something that comes from his heart rather than a list of self-care tips I guess.[/Offtopic]

[autumnhearth]

The JLR Tech Fest thing is amusing, what a strange choice. The quote tweets had me snickering. I want to be proud of him, but it's just so bizarre. Nice photos though.

Is no one analyzing the reflection in the "water feature" for layout help? (Please keep it up though, I love floorplans.)

I didn't see anyone post timestamps for the LS? Could've missed it between board game drama. Just a few things here that interested me.

2:24 Cut his own hair, because it was fine, it just "lost the thing"? Is that what he said? What?

4:03 If you can refer to yourself as an ugly pigeon, it just means you're not taking life too seriously. I mean, maybe. There's also the whole using humor to cover deeper issues thing that some people have.

9:00 I worry that they really do think Dil is the only thing keeping the channel going. That the overwhelming majority of viewers don't actually care about "real" (not the right word, but you know what I mean) games at all and would be bored by them. And I worry more that it's true.

10:48 Glitter from Phil's sheets in washing machine. "I put all of my clothes, that I actually had to wash, in the machine" as opposed to things that didn't actually have to be washed being put in the machine (and clogging it with glitter)?
Also, how did he have gold glitter on his hand when Phil used blue, white, and silver?

I sped through GBB, music, and other tv talk at 2x speed because I don't care, which makes it far more entertaining.

15:08 Upgraded their broadband just for livestream gaming. They seem really committed to the idea. It's not something I ever expected they'd have interest in, and now it seems to be a big focus. Easy content? Is there an extra revenue thing with it? I know it had the subscribe thing that they didn't dismiss and probably subtly encouraged.

The last stream "didn't remotely feel like any kind of work" - another interesting phrase. The initial gaming channel pitch was "hey we love games, might as well film them", but realistically, anytime you start doing something you like for money, it becomes a job. It can still be fun, but it changes a bit. So it's nice that they were able to just have fun with it and hopefully not overthink.

Mostly I'm glad they told us ahead of time when the next one is instead of hiding it on twitter at the last minute.

35:10 Complains about Phil making him climb the stairs for pigeon drama... but he obviously did it without too much hesitation.

Too lazy to note times, but it's funny how he has completely opposite reactions to the same filters at several points.

So many rat comments, and references to his self-imposed pressure to be interesting and the awareness of how varied the expectations and reaction are. His sentence about philosophy pretty much summed up all the meme video talk here very succinctly. Mental health would be dangerous for the same reason. You can say it would be good if he did it the "right way", but 6 million subscribers have 6 million opinions on what that means.

Thanks for the timestamps! I heard "my hair was fine but it just lost a thing" at 2:33. He could mean shape, or maybe clippers, but who knows. I hate it when he cuts himself off.

I'm not great with reflections, especially on convex surfaces and that little metal sphere doesn't seem to be reveal much. However... there is something that I missed.



At 6:35 Dan shifts his position and we get some "ceiling content" but like what are those taupe things? They seem too irregularly layered to be window shades. Do they slide? Then there is a beam (which they do seem to have in between their windows in that room, but is that next section a window or an opening to another room? It certainly doesn't have the same taupe things. Maybe they do slide and can cover the whole wall of windows and are just retracted to that corner currently. That's my theory.

Anyone know that the green O shaped thing is on on top of the game board tower? Or is it a 1 inside a green circle (in which case I can guess). Or any of that stuff. I think the curving thing that looks a bit like a lamp used to be on their mantel. Is it an award? Did they ever give the lungs back? I'm revealing what a fake fan I am.

[Birdie]

I'm so here for Dan just sneakily being on serious panels without even announcing it. I also love the descriptions of his and Jim's jobs. Poor Jim though.

I hate the term gaslighting when it's being applied to closeted couples. Gaslighting as a phrase stems from a description of abuse and abusive behavior; a closeted person who isn't ready to come out will almost always find themselves in situations where they have to lie, and potentially lie to someone who knows that they're lying. For Dan and Phil, the issue of personal comfort and safety/security is amplified by an invasive audience and it becomes about privacy as well. They're allowed to change their minds on how much they want us to know, especially given that changing their minds came on the heels of being forcibly outed. They're allowed to feel like sharing more sometimes and less sometimes depending on the specific audience.

To shift Dan and Phil's behavior out of the realm of 'self-protection/protecting their privacy' and align it with abuse just feels so achingly unempathetic to me. It's not abuse of fans for them to make decisions for themselves above us.

Very well said.

[confusedpanda]

Anyone know that the green O shaped thing is on on top of the game board tower? Or is it a 1 inside a green circle (in which case I can guess). Or any of that stuff. I think the curving thing that looks a bit like a lamp used to be on their mantel. Is it an award? Did they ever give the lungs back? I'm revealing what a fake fan I am.

The green circle is their radio one teen award they won last year!

The curving one is a headphone from the Sony music awards (I can't remember the name, I hope it's this) that they won for the radio show back in 2013.

They did send the lungs back I believe sometime last year.

[autumnhearth]

Thanks confusedpanda! I'm less confused now

[alch]

I guess to me it's just a lot more weight behind the words "mental health", a lot more implications of disease and disorder, rather than just not being in a great frame of mind or feeling bad. idk y'all, maybe my perception of the phrase is wrong.

I feel like I remember him saying he had social anxiety in a liveshow at some point? I may just be completely misremembering though.

Also that panel looks interesting! Is there a full version that one could watch?

[flarequake]

The panel looks interesting, also he looks like a fricking model as usual. It's a shame the quoted bits sound a bit banal. If the really need to be told young people want to do things and it's good if tech helps... yikes. Maybe they're not listening to any other young people they know and need a star to make it clearer.

I'm looking forward to the gaming stream, not overly bothered what they play, though it'd be cool if they could find games they can play against the audience some of the time. I don't know how feasible that is.

I'd be intrigued to hear his take on mental health, though my first thought is how he could address it with some seriousness and have it fit with the humour in his videos. Maybe I'm forgetting how serious some of his storytelling videos have been, like the story of his hamster perhaps. I'm concerned by the pressure of expectations already on here. He did say in a recent liveshow that he has social anxiety and his own experience would be more interesting to me than something talking about every type of problem out there plus the inadequacy of the health service. There are more knowledgable people out there, like Kati Morton, addressing those things, though not enough so if he has something to say, I'm all for it. I don't think we can expect him to learn everything there is to put it all in one video and say it how we all think it should be said, though. I know how sensitive it is for everyone who deals with it, but I don't think one person can be made to be the spokesperson who gets it all correct just because they've got an audience.

[sugar]

I hate the term gaslighting when it's being applied to closeted couples. Gaslighting as a phrase stems from a description of abuse and abusive behavior; a closeted person who isn't ready to come out will almost always find themselves in situations where they have to lie, and potentially lie to someone who knows that they're lying. For Dan and Phil, the issue of personal comfort and safety/security is amplified by an invasive audience and it becomes about privacy as well. They're allowed to change their minds on how much they want us to know, especially given that changing their minds came on the heels of being forcibly outed. They're allowed to feel like sharing more sometimes and less sometimes depending on the specific audience.

To shift Dan and Phil's behavior out of the realm of 'self-protection/protecting their privacy' and align it with abuse just feels so achingly unempathetic to me. It's not abuse of fans for them to make decisions for themselves above us.

i was really hoping someone would say this as i was backreading and got to the conversation on gaslighting.

couples that are not ready to be outed shouldn't need to out themselves to keep you comfortable in your perception of their relationship. this also ties into why the anti-phan argument of 'they said they weren't together so i'll continue to believe them' kind of...infuriates me. but that's not really a conversation we need to get into.

also pretty irrelevant but as someone who has no choice but to drive everywhere i go, i'm a bit bothered by dan's statement that millennials only drive when they want to. of course he feels that way as he most likely hasn't driven in years, lives in a city with fantastic transportation 24 hours of the day, and can pretty much afford any other kind of transportation that he would need to get no matter how last minute. i, on the other hand, don't have that luxury. public transportation where i live is almost non existent. i drive everywhere i go and i travel quite often. and i actually love driving, especially alone. i'll be driving 12 hours each way to chicago next weekend for a festival and i'm quite excited about it. additionally, i have the feeling that most millennials can't afford to fly when it's close enough that driving is an option. this is really pointless but i guess i'm just saying i don't think that dan should be the voice on millennials re: driving. as he lives somewhere that it's almost entirely unnecessary and for most people...that's just not the case.

[fondsmiles]

I'm finding the discussion on a possible mental health video (and also the healthcare systems across the world) very interesting. I am glad so many people have shared their thoughts and stories!

I think there's big potential for him in taking himself a bit more seriously on his channel. He doesn't do that very often, but he does it more in live shows for example, and I'd love to see him extend that to DINOF.

He also just has a huge platform and he could do a lot of good with it, if he feels personally comfortable to share a part of his story. Not saying he has to, and I also understand that exactly this huge platform makes it hard, because as we see here already, people have many concerns and he is the kind of guy who wants to take all those concerns into account. But if he does want to, and if he talks about a part of his journey and addresses that
- he is no professional/is only an expert for his own experience
- professional help is important and it's okay to seek it out, but it also doesn't hurt to keep a critical mind (e.g. change a professional if it feels hugely wrong)
- it can get better. (in any way or form, just a message that leaves people feeling like there is something they can do, instead of only more hopeless than they might have been before)
he could really have an impact. I'd be so proud of him.

i don't know if he'd do this, since maybe less control on such a personal topic, but I'd also love for him to collab with Kati Morton. she's done videos with people like Hannah Hart before and is an awesome mental health youtuber, who comes from a totally professional stance and educates mostly.

he could even maybe ask her for help with a video he does himself, just to make sure he's not harming anyone or something like this. me? just posting this for dan to maybe see and consider? yes that is exactly what i'm doing

[Offtopic]I was a bit shocked by all your mental health care systems. It's not perfect here in Germany either, but waiting lists for public health care therapists are only a couple months, not years. And therapies are longer than in the UK as well,
I think. And at least the a bit younger therapists have quite a high standard of education, it's long and expensive and only dedicated people go through it. I'm hoping there's change where you are, it's so important [/Offtopic]

in other news, I AM SO EXCITED FOR THE GAMING STREAM HOLY HECK

[autumnhearth]

awwsugar the tweet actually says the opposite. I think he was saying they drive out of necessity, not out of desire. I'm sure he realizes many millennials don't have access to public transportation. I'm guessing his point is that driving has become a chore and has lost its thrill for this generation. I am curious if/how he expanded on that.

[MythicalPinkTrashCan]

[Offtopic]

Stampy uploaded this video over a year ago, but I just saw it this week. (and I lightly checked it hadn't been talked about already in here) I think it's exactly what Phil thinks when it comes to his Family Friendly Persona. I wish Phil would talk about stuff like this more. [/Offtopic]

[jaej]

[Offtopic]i basically think a mental health video would be more negative than positive because people feel very strongly about their own experiences, and no matter how hard he tries to make it clear that its his own experience, some people are going to feel invalidated (or say they are on behalf of others)

i've always personally had a positive experience with mental health help in scotland, and it took about as long as it would with a physical illness to get enrolled in group classes, speak one to one with a professional, get the right medication dosage etc. if he says something similar, there would definitely be a backlash of people saying "no my doctor didn't do that"/"i cant afford that"/"the specific treatment you did didn't work for me and is therefore bad"

there's also that thing i see a lot on tumblr and stuff of just refusing to do small things to make yourself feel a little better. if he says something about exercise or eating healthier or something really simple like opening a window being something that made a positive change for him, there would be a massive "some of us have REAL problems, we can't all be neurotypical!!" flood, despite those all being things that will benefit lots of people who do have mental illnesses, even though that benefit is unlikely to be that huge.

[/Offtopic]

[sugar]

awwsugar the tweet actually says the opposite. I think he was saying they drive out of necessity, not out of desire. I'm sure he realizes many millennials don't have access to public transportation. I'm guessing his point is that driving has become a chore and has lost its thrill for this generation. I am curious if/how he expanded on that.

hm, yea i got that i think my rambling just made no real sense. i personally love driving and i don't think any of my friends really feel like it's a chore so that's more what i disagreed with. i guess it's different for everyone. if i grew up somewhere that i could get everyone on public transport, maybe i'd feel differently!

[Artdefines06]

Tomska has done several videos with Kati Marton as well, each one focusing on a specific issue like anger, depression, stress eating, etc that have to do with his personal problems. He will discuss what he does and how he feels, and then she provides the facts to either back up his feelings or explain what is actually happening that he might not have understood, and then she tells him some things he might be able to do to help. I enjoyed them. Kati is the type of Youtuber I would be. I definitely think doing these videos with a professional next to you keeping you on topic and correcting any misconceptions is the way safest way to go, but it isn't as entertaining as say a 5 types of drunk people type sketch. Dan seems pretty set on staying in the sketch comedy zone, and that is a hard thing to balance. I think he is very aware of all of this, which is why he hasn't really broached the topic. I would rather have a well thought out and educational discussion that another ham handed joke about throwing himself off a bridge because he can't find a pokemon.

Also, I'm throwing snipperclips into the guesses for the liveshow today.

[fondsmiles]

[Offtopic]i basically think a mental health video would be more negative than positive because people feel very strongly about their own experiences, and no matter how hard he tries to make it clear that its his own experience, some people are going to feel invalidated (or say they are on behalf of others)

i've always personally had a positive experience with mental health help in scotland, and it took about as long as it would with a physical illness to get enrolled in group classes, speak one to one with a professional, get the right medication dosage etc. if he says something similar, there would definitely be a backlash of people saying "no my doctor didn't do that"/"i cant afford that"/"the specific treatment you did didn't work for me and is therefore bad"

there's also that thing i see a lot on tumblr and stuff of just refusing to do small things to make yourself feel a little better. if he says something about exercise or eating healthier or something really simple like opening a window being something that made a positive change for him, there would be a massive "some of us have REAL problems, we can't all be neurotypical!!" flood, despite those all being things that will benefit lots of people who do have mental illnesses, even though that benefit is unlikely to be that huge.

[/Offtopic]

I see what you're saying, and I agree - there would be backlash, and people saying that he's not doing the right thing, and all of that. People will say that regardless of how he approaches the topic.
but in my opinion, that's exactly why it would be great. it is a controversial topic because it needs conversation happening around it. if he knows he'll be okay with the backlash next to the probably big wave of support, him putting out his own experience and talking about healthy ways to cope would be exactly what I think is beneficial about it. if someone doesn't tell people small positive actions are part of recovery for example, they'll keep disregarding it as "just a neurotypical opinion".

going deeper into topics is bound to make people unhappy, but only those topics also have a profound impact on people.

[QuiteFriendly]

I hate the term gaslighting when it's being applied to closeted couples. Gaslighting as a phrase stems from a description of abuse and abusive behavior; a closeted person who isn't ready to come out will almost always find themselves in situations where they have to lie, and potentially lie to someone who knows that they're lying. For Dan and Phil, the issue of personal comfort and safety/security is amplified by an invasive audience and it becomes about privacy as well. They're allowed to change their minds on how much they want us to know, especially given that changing their minds came on the heels of being forcibly outed. They're allowed to feel like sharing more sometimes and less sometimes depending on the specific audience.

To shift Dan and Phil's behavior out of the realm of 'self-protection/protecting their privacy' and align it with abuse just feels so achingly unempathetic to me. It's not abuse of fans for them to make decisions for themselves above us.

I honestly agree with everything you say here and it wasn’t my intention to give the impression that I blame them or anyone else who lies to protect themselves. I don’t think that Dan and/or Phil gaslighted their fans. At all. I just recognized the feeling and that was a bit interesting to me. Generally I’m annoyed that lack of intent is used to excuse all kinds of behaviour and that lack of intent often means that no one was supposedly hurt. After reading everybody’s posts (and thinking about it over a beer), I realize that gaslighting is very much about intent.

I had a “friend”, a best friend I thought, who in a couple of months managed to make me appear, to myself and others, completely irresponsible. I thought other people was lying to me or that I just couldn’t remember things right. I finally had a breakdown over not understanding my school schedule and a teacher connected the dots. I didn’t even though I could see the proofs. I know how horrible gaslighting can be and how confused I was for a long time. Dan and Phil never made me feel anything close to that and the use of gaslighting as a way to explain those feelings wasn’t right.

I never meant that dnp was intentionally hurtful. I will always side with people who wants to keep their lgbt+ status private, I mean I do.

So, that how about that live stream?

[Ablissa]

They postponed by an hour or I remembered wrong?
Nice of him to advertise Stand Up To Cancer though

[Artdefines06]

The definitely postposed by an hour, which is annoying because I have things to do later...Why was there no warning about the Stand up to cancer thing though? I am subscribed to all their things and now they are just suddenly streaming with no warning and pumping out tons of videos and filling up my sub box? I don't get it.

[alch]

[Offtopic]i basically think a mental health video would be more negative than positive because people feel very strongly about their own experiences, and no matter how hard he tries to make it clear that its his own experience, some people are going to feel invalidated (or say they are on behalf of others)

i've always personally had a positive experience with mental health help in scotland, and it took about as long as it would with a physical illness to get enrolled in group classes, speak one to one with a professional, get the right medication dosage etc. if he says something similar, there would definitely be a backlash of people saying "no my doctor didn't do that"/"i cant afford that"/"the specific treatment you did didn't work for me and is therefore bad"

there's also that thing i see a lot on tumblr and stuff of just refusing to do small things to make yourself feel a little better. if he says something about exercise or eating healthier or something really simple like opening a window being something that made a positive change for him, there would be a massive "some of us have REAL problems, we can't all be neurotypical!!" flood, despite those all being things that will benefit lots of people who do have mental illnesses, even though that benefit is unlikely to be that huge.

[/Offtopic]

I agree that there would be a lot of negative backlash, but I don't think Dan should shy away from making a video on a more controversial topic just because there's a lot of people who would disagree. As long as, like fondsmiles said, he clarified that he is not an expert on this topic.

[flarequake]

Stand up to cancer have been tweeting for a few days, I think the info was all on there instead.

[liola]

Why are they always late on liveshows lately? I'm procrastinating studying

[chiccola]

Shouldn't they be on now? :bbb:

Anyways, looks like Bryony is on holiday already

Maybe they're joining them as soon as they're done with all the work and not "next week" as they implied

[Lucyrg95]

PHIL LESTER DID A LITTLE LAUGH AT MY COMMENT REST IN PEACE ME I actually said insert a witty message here not meme but ok phil

[alittledizzy]

I'm just gonna assume Dan meant to @ me when he talked about kickthefire fanfic.

[SquishPhan]

I'm really loving these gaming live streams. Pleased that they fixed both the audio and the lag.
Them mentioning Phil's mother and that she watches (some of) their gaming vids was great. As was seeing them work together, something I always enjoy.

I'm just gonna assume Dan meant to @ me when he talked about kickthefire fanfic.

I'm not going to lie, that was my first thought too.